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[–] smeezekitty 17 points 77 points (+94|-17) ago 

What a disaster. MS will have to pry Windows 7 from my cold dead fingers. As soon as 7 becomes unusable, I am going to Linux

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[–] KL1 6 points 7 points (+13|-6) ago 

If I may, no OS becomes unstable unless it was unstable from the begining. It's almost always the user's misuse or lack of knowledge that makes an OS unstable. I gave my dad (60s) my old XP desktop and it's been running with no major trouble for 8 years now. Like you I personally use W7 and will probably not upgrade any time soon.

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[–] JimmyJimRyan 0 points 42 points (+42|-0) ago 

I think he might mean unsupported. XP is still stable but it's full of security holes.

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[–] industrialfish 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

My previous gaming system built in 2004 still runs XP flawlessly.

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[–] smeezekitty 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

I mean unusable as in software and drivers stop supporting it.

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[–] dalek_caan 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

I agree. My friend still uses his old computer with Windows XP bought in 2007 or so.

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[–] Gamedude 22 points 1 points (+23|-22) ago 

No more proper gaming for you?

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[–] Mr-Lahey 1 points 65 points (+66|-1) ago 

I really hope Linux gaming becomes a viable option in the future. It's possible if valve keeps pushing SteamOS.

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[–] tokamakZero 1 points 30 points (+31|-1) ago 

Unreal Engine 4 games can compile on linux. There's even a version of the editor that runs natively on linux.

It's coming...

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[–] Anomander 0 points 7 points (+7|-0) ago 

Linux is steadily growing in the gaming department. Just yesterday they released Shadow of Mordor for Linux, earlier this month they ported KoToR II, and on top of that UE4 and Unity work on Linux now. It's not long before gaming on Linux will be just as good as Windows.

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[–] naughtysnake 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

By the time Windows 7 becomes unusable, Linux gaming will be competent.

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[–] InsaneMonkey 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

1/2 these "features" will probably come to 7 and 8 through updates and the other 1/2 probably already exist without our knowledge.

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[–] daplan 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

go for it. the sooner the better. have done my switch 6 months ago and I have no regrets sofar. Steam works pretty well for gaming :)

[–] [deleted] 2 points 52 points (+54|-2) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] InternetTuffGuy 14 points 57 points (+71|-14) ago 

Even quicker fix: Don't use Windows 10. Ever.

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[–] THE_CHOSEN_ONE 13 points 33 points (+46|-13) ago 

hate to break it to you bro, but you're sending about just as much info with Windows 7 (granted that's what you're using) as you are with Windows 10. just because the options to turn it off aren't there, doesn't mean Microsoft isn't collecting your data.

meanwhile i'm over here enjoying my 10 fps boost with dx12, after going into the options and configuring all the settings to my desire (took about 2 minutes). you just have to be a little tech savvy to use Windows 10

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[–] p0ssum 7 points 25 points (+32|-7) ago 

Friends don't let friends install Windows 10

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[–] JimmyJimRyan 0 points 5 points (+5|-0) ago 

I can change it but can my mother and my granny. I don't think the "you can change it" thing is good enough. Not everyone is a techy.

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[–] flimflamedthezimzam 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

It really is my fault for stepping on that landmine, I made the independent decision to place my foot down without taking the personal responsibility to ensure that there wasn't a landmine there. I mean, even though MS placed a minefield around my house in the middle of the night anyone familiar with modern minefields should have known to recognize it. I did have the option of just staying indoors.

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[–] tribblepuncher 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

This seems to be the attitude of a lot of people who yell "you can turn it off!" or "you can just shell out extra cash for Professional!" in the face of objections to the Windows 10 defaults. Additionally, I've heard some reports (which I can't substantiate at this time, but I think it's a possibility) that even Professional doesn't really clobber ALL of Microsoft's code that engages in questionable activities, which is less than reassuring (and Pro doesn't REALLY stop forced updates without paying a hefty price).

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[–] gindc 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

I would also strongly recommend turning off the secondary proxy service and port 777. Both are used in P2P internet communication.

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[–] RudeBootie 16 points 41 points (+57|-16) ago 

Nothing in this world is free. Windows 10 is proof positive of that. I feel bad for anyone who installed that glorified keylogger

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[–] JimmyJimRyan 1 points 20 points (+21|-1) ago 

Linux is free

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[–] Vespera 8 points 9 points (+17|-8) ago  (edited ago)

Free isn't enough. People need compatibility and ease of use.

Linux is more a tool than an OS for everyday people.

Edit: Before replying, please watch this video(Linus Torvalds interview)

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[–] johnnyfortune 2 points 5 points (+7|-2) ago 

Linux is free if your time is worthless.

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[–] Tantalus 29 points 5 points (+34|-29) ago 

Nobody has posted anything resembling evidence that W10 is keylogging. That would be a big deal if proven.

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[–] RudeBootie 20 points 38 points (+58|-20) ago 

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[–] MCVoat 0 points 7 points (+7|-0) ago 

Found Bill Gates!

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[–] GeorgepantsMcg 1 points 2 points (+3|-1) ago 

What kind of phone do you use?

Do you use any Google services?

What about Dropbox or Google drive? Cloud-based email?

I'd love to hear how you're actually controlling your privacy. How about PRISM? I'm sure you've scanned and checked everything from your SSL to your current OS registry and are sure that you're super safe.

Or is this just a bunch of FUD because it's cool to hate on anything windows after 7...?

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[–] vanities 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

Not trying to Microsoft shill here, but also enjoy not having the new directX.

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[–] CombustibLemons 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

I installed it. I love it. Best OS ever. No complaints so far.

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[–] Kleyno 8 points 24 points (+32|-8) ago 

I don't really have a problem with this, as I do not have a data usage cap. Though it certainly shouldn't have been the default option.

P2P has been around for ages, and if you use it for certain... questionable activities, then it is all pretty much the same thing.

The real problem is if the system becomes compromised, which, let's be honest, is always a possibility, no matter how many layers of security you build into a system.

Or if Microsoft is using it for something other than what they say they are, which, again, is likely.

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[–] Gamedude 3 points 23 points (+26|-3) ago 

When a game use P2P(Battle.net use it a lot). No one cares. But when a OS uses it, madness.

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[–] OskarW85 0 points 25 points (+25|-0) ago 

Maybe because it's obvious in case of Battlenet and completely hidden in case of Win10. Many people have data caps that would be blown by this.

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[–] goatimhimmel 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

Also guilty, Spotify.

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[–] RandomNumberGod 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Video games are not a fundamental part of your computer's software environment. You can just vote with your wallet and ditch Blizzard if enabling P2P by default offends you that much.

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[–] realpatrickstewart 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Uhh... you've completely missed the point. When you run Pandora, you're USING Pandora. When you run Starcraft 2, you're USING Starcraft 2.

Windows 10 using your bandwidth is akin to Notepad computing bitcoins without your knowledge. It's not RELATED to what you're doing at all.

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[–] devgeek0 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

From my perspective, the difference with distribution of video games is the following: (a) I benefit directly because I want to get my game downloads as fast as possible, and (b) I know when it is happening (when I open the client).

On the flip side of the coin, (a) This is just a cost-saving measure by Microsoft (paid by my bandwidth dollars) that provides me with no real benefit because I don't give a damn about how quickly my OS updates download, and (b) I have no visibility or control over when this is active on my device.

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[–] Monkey2674 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

You are getting security updates for FREE. If you dont want them install whatever windows you had before and remove windows update. They are not charging for this upgrade or the security and bug fixes after. Heck for people that turn it off you should be made to pay a subscription fee for updates.

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[–] iamnotanerd 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Yep. People need to calm their tits.

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[–] pdizz 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Thank you. This is really no different than seeding, which people do willingly all the time for media, software, linux distros, etc. The only problem I see, like you said, is that you have to opt out instead of opt in

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[–] CrudOMatic 3 points 21 points (+24|-3) ago 

Microsoft has went full retard with this one. I'll switch to Linux before I use Win10.

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[–] Orbitrix 12 points 0 points (+12|-12) ago  (edited ago)

That's really ignorant. Load Win10 up in a virtual machine, at least show yourself what its like. All the negative stuff the media has been reporting can either be turned off during install, by clicking a link when it describes all the privacy stuff to you. And the rest can be taken care of w/ a few registry hacks. The Window 10 you wan't is already there, the media is just retarded, and over sensationalizing stuff just because its 'default', even though it can be easy changed...

You're taking just as much of a privacy risk not running the latest software. If "PGP" doesn't mean anything to you, our data's already compromised anyways. So the privacy conerns are, a bit silly at best.

And if you're running Windows Pro i think you still have a decent amount of control over when updates are installed even without registry hacks.... But lol... i'm willing to bet most people complaining about this have a windows install that auto-updates as we speak...

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[–] V-sync 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

You shouldn't have to fight your operating system to not be a detriment to your security. And since Windows is non-free software anyway you have no idea what is really going on. On Linux I can be pretty confident my OS isn't being used to distribute ads to me, logging my keystrokes, etc... How can you defend Windows 10 when you have no idea what it's really doing?

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[–] Kappa00 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

What does windows 10 allow me to do that I could not do in a dual boot machine with windows 8 and linux?

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[–] CrudOMatic 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Oh, so I have to know it's there, in order to turn it off... instead of it being off by default. Then on top of that, there's features that I have to hack the registry for - no easy way to turn it off - and I have to know about that too. What's up with Win10 "needing" to send telemetry data to M$, else the OS won't work? Win7 works just fine without it - why does M$ need telemetry data?

Then we have the SUPREME WINRAR with Win10 POSTING YOUR WIRELESS NETWORK INFO, KEY AND ALL TO FACEBOOK. Why do this? It makes ZERO fucking sense, and IMHO is only there so the government can look at FB's data and scrape WiFi names & keys.

Why are you giving M$ a pass on this crap? /v/hailcorporate?

You're taking just as much of a privacy risk not running the latest software. If "PGP" doesn't mean anything to you, our data's already compromised anyways. So the privacy conerns are, a bit silly at best.

So if I don't sign my emails with a PGP key, then my concerns about security are "silly"? My email isn't worth protecting, I don't do anything sensitive with it (because I'm not an idiot) - so you're silly. You sound like a spook trying to convince me to install the spy camera myself.

Besides, Win7 will continue to get updates for the foreseeable future - so for your claims of not running the latest software... pfft.

That's really ignorant. Load Win10 up in a virtual machine, at least show yourself what its like.

No thanks, I don't have the disk space for 2 OSes - nor am I interested in installing the spy camera myself. Plus I hated Win8, and it's a lot like Win8, so I'll switch to Linux when Win7 becomes unusable.

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[–] tribblepuncher 0 points 15 points (+15|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Just a bit of a notice for everyone who's going, "try it out first!"

You are missing the point, by a LOT.

The simple fact of the matter is that many of us are completely unwilling to sell out our privacy or security for a few user interface tweaks, or even a vastly improved user experience. It simply is not worth the price for us.

It doesn't matter that you can turn it off - the level of effectiveness is questionable at this point, so far as I know. Plus, a lot of people don't know what they're signing up for, or may have the choices made for them by someone else. Plus, the fact that it's there at all is an unsavory sign of things to come.

It doesn't matter that some things can be thwarted with registry hacks. Registry hacks - that's insane to expect of anyone. That's why they shoved it in there, to make it too scary for most users to use it.

It doesn't matter that Windows 10 Professional can disable it. In the case of forced upgrades, you pay a steep price for that, and nevertheless you are still giving up control of your computer in a very new and significant way. The simple ability to say "no" is massive, psychologically and practically. Plus, it is not a good sign overall if "pay more" is the only way to get control over your computer, especially since it's hardly out of the realm of possibility that the "more" you have to pay may eventually be far out of the reach of most users.

It doesn't matter if the NSA can get it. The NSA is a massively powerful organization, but they're still only one organization - there are many ways that this can be abused that other organizations can't crack, and the NSA is also far from perfect. Heck, even if everyone stays above board with all of this, the amount of data Microsoft collects on people is going to draw the attention and envy of hackers at least as badly as the OPM attacks.

It doesn't matter if everyone else is doing it, because if that's the case, then for once Microsoft was doing the RIGHT THING, or at least the less wrong thing, and now we're being hemmed in here. It also doesn't matter if they "did the same thing" with prior versions - while I doubt that, they're also doing it a ton more of it now, which is not something that gives a lot of people a great deal of joy. While it is good that they're at least up front about it, options continue to be limited. This is not just something with Windows 10, either, so the problem certainly isn't there, but it's a massive step in a direction many of us do not want to take, and you should consider carefully whether you want to take it, either, especially considering how things pop up these days such as a single tweet ruining your career.

And furthermore, another thing matters to us - for all of you who are willing to accept all this? We're being dragged down with you. Most of us can't use Linux for everything (and switching jobs for that is unlikely) even if we forget the gaming aspect. And for all practical purposes, we can't use Windows 7 forever. With this becoming the standard norm, we are making a corporation owning our equipment and telling us what we will and won't do with it far closer to the norm. The fact that Google (with Android) and Apple seem to already be in that category is bad enough.

Keep that in mind next time you decide to, say, torrent something on your own that may not exactly fit the MPAA or RIAA's approval, or even view something on YouTube that may not meet their approval. They're already getting Google to buckle on the search engine terms. Wanna bet that they'll stay away from the ever-increasing troves of data Microsoft is hoarding forever?

Anyway, I hope that that at least explains it to those who think we should try it. They won't take money for it (or rather, they will, but that doesn't matter), and the price they're asking is far too steep for some of us, and actions taken today may entirely preclude a choice on that in the future.

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[–] GrimShins 3 points -2 points (+1|-3) ago 

If you seriously think that Windows was ever better about user privacy and infosec than it is today, it's time to put down the pipe.

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[–] tribblepuncher 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

Passively? Perhaps. But...

https://jonathan.porta.codes/2015/07/30/windows-10-seems-to-have-some-scary-privacy-defaults/

I don't recall Microsoft ever being so actively and invasively trying to subvert it before. Nor do I recall them forcing updates so that any of workarounds that people have found (or built-in options Microsoft no longer deems desirable) will be patched out in due time.

If you can find anything about Windows XP or 7 sending information about your typing history to Microsoft to default, I would be most interested.

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[–] MrDarkKV 6 points 15 points (+21|-6) ago 

Man, the Windows 10 hate on this thread is real..

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[–] CombustibLemons 11 points 4 points (+15|-11) ago 

Voat's always been huge into hating Windows 10. I don't have a problem with it. I'm really enjoying it so far. I'm really not worried about them spying on me, because I'm sure Google knows 1000 times more just by hosting my email, not including G+, calendar, etc. Or Facebook, which literally makes money off selling your data.

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[–] Easybee 0 points 10 points (+10|-0) ago 

Yeah but Google doesn't keylog everything you do in your OS, and doesn't store information on your private files (such as file name and how often you open it...).

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[–] ninjai 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

This is the wrong way to look at it. You should value your privacy.

The right to privacy protects the innocent more than the guilty.

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[–] Trip 7 points 2 points (+9|-7) ago 

I'm also really loving windows 10. I have a feeling the vast majority of haters haven't even used the OS. You can disable nearly all of the things they complain about. Sure it's a dick move of microsoft to not make those the defaults. But it's still annoying to see people talking about it like it's the end of the world. I Disabled what they are complaining about in this thread in under 30 seconds, and it was pretty obvious how to do it.

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[–] tribblepuncher 0 points 9 points (+9|-0) ago  (edited ago)

The privacy and forced upgrade "features" are going to be preventing me from using the OS, so I'm not going to be judging it based on the user experience. No amount of smoothness or responsiveness is going to cause me to let go of control over my computer so easily. And I have my doubts as to just how effective the opt-out is, and the auto-opt-in defaults are plenty of indication as to where Microsoft is going to push this thing. I am quite certain I am not the only one. And I am quite certain that the fact that "everyone else is doing it" is completely and utterly irrelevant - if anything it makes it WORSE because Microsoft may have been doing the right thing (or less bad thing) for once, and now that's gone. And "pay more for Professional to be able to control your computer" is a rather disturbing attitude when it's the most important and most fundamental piece of software on the machine.

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[–] MrDarkKV 2 points -2 points (+0|-2) ago 

I guess people just don't like change.. Maybe? I mean I still have ughh.. 'friends' who are on XP because they say its by far the best and fastest OS. I've given up on trying to reason with them .

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[–] just_a_tech 2 points 0 points (+2|-2) ago 

Been using it and I have no problems with it. I've turned off all the features people are complaining about on Voat. The damn installation tells you about most of them during setup and gives you the option to turn them off right then. The rest are pretty obvious for anyone who pays attention to their settings.

[–] [deleted] 0 points 5 points (+5|-0) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] glassuser 4 points -1 points (+3|-4) ago 

Yeah there seems to be a ridiculously vocal windows 10 hate crew here.

[–] [deleted] 6 points 14 points (+20|-6) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] noep 1 points 39 points (+40|-1) ago 

Win7 and full user control

Thinking you have full control of any closed source program is probably a little naive.

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[–] Huntard 4 points 8 points (+12|-4) ago 

Even with open source software this is still a little naive. Unless he's a software developer and he enjoys reading others people code, of course.

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[–] KL1 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

In theory, you are absolutely correct. Blind faith or 100% trust in any tech company is naive. Still when you are able to edit the registry or about:config or the like, you can have a pretty good grip on what your OS or software is allowed or not allowed to do. In addition to disabling any automatic update, and only manually updating after reviewing the features/limitations of the new version.

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[–] tame 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

Spot on. For instance, what's the default search engine in Thunderbird? Why IS there even an internet search engine linked into a mail app? And how easy is it to select the most popular search engine?

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[–] dbag2070 5 points -3 points (+2|-5) ago  (edited ago)

I will stick to Win7 and full user control

hahahahahahahahaha...... full control oh god you crack me up! GG

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