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[–] FuckYouReddit- 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Because Paul Ryan is a complete douche.

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[–] guinness2 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Why are we no longer trying to get rid of it? Is that no longer a viable possibility?

It hasn't.

The mainstream media are just claiming that because there are commonalities between the two plans (i.e. they are both health care bills) then President Trump's bill is exactly the same as Obamacare. Some of the existing laws are the same only because it would be impossible for two health care bills to share absolutely no similarities given they are both concerned with health care.

Before we discuss recent events, you'll need to remember back to Obama's first term: it took the Obamacare bill 54 failed attempts to pass before the final iteration received enough votes... and it took Obama over three years of budget negotiations before he was granted the funding to proceed. The reason I mention this is because it's unreasonable for anyone to expect large bills to pass in their initial version without an iterative process as the houses debate the legislation. The (((American mainstream media))) has devolved into something that North Korea would be ashamed of.

I suspect President Trump was testing the waters with the first attempt of "Ryan care", knowing the bill wouldn't pass. This is his normal strategy: he makes an initial and profoundly unreasonable demand and when it is rejected, he presents what he always wanted as the compromise and then he ends up getting what he wants.

The mainstream media have been screaming and crying about how everyone will die if President Trump's American Health Care Act (AHCA) is passed because of one reason or another. This is just bullshit and if you look at any of that globalist propaganda, you'll discover it's baseless gossip from faceless, nameless, fictional "high ranking White House sources" or biased opinions from Never-Trump senators.

Keep in mind that criticisms from Paul Ryan, Marco Rubio, Jeb Bush, John McCain, John Kasich and Lindsey Graham should be considered bullshit given those politicians are owned by George Soros. That's the reason why every time you see reports of "Republicans opposing President Trump", it's usually these two enemies of Western civilization.

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[–] alele-opathic [S] 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago  (edited ago)

The mainstream media are just claiming that because there are commonalities between the two plans [...] then President Trump's bill is exactly the same as Obamacare.

This was the one of the fallacies I was operating under, thanks. Even with this resolved, it still doesn't answer for me why the ACA shouldn't just be repealed wholesale. Is a healthcare act of any form, Trump's or otherwise, really necessary? Things certainly seemed to be peachy pre-ACA.

he makes an initial and profoundly unreasonable demand and when it is rejected, he presents what he always wanted as the compromise and then he ends up getting what he wants.

This is standard for negotiation, so makes sense.

The mainstream media have been screaming and crying about how everyone will die if President Trump's American Health Care Act

This was no different from when the ACA was passed, most people (myself included) don't pay any attention to the news anymore. I personally wasn't even aware of the fearmongering, but again, my main question is 'why any healthcare bill at all?'

Is there any way Trump's bill can possibly improve things over the 'free market' we had before any of this mess started?

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[–] guinness2 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

it still doesn't answer for me why the ACA shouldn't just be repealed wholesale.

Why replace laws which are perfect just so they can be re-introduced at a huge delay and expense to the taxpayer... because they are needed?

The difference between claiming Obamacare is being completely repealed or only partially repealed is a subjective and philosophical difference.

Is there any way Trump's bill can possibly improve things over the 'free market' we had before any of this mess started?

President Trump is allowing competition for insurers between state lines.

President Trump said this during a press conference in January:

I think a lot of industries are going to be coming back. We have to get our drug industry coming back. Our drug industry has been disastrous. They’re leaving left and right. They supply our drugs, but they don't make them here. To a large extent. And the other thing we have to do is create a new bidding procedures for the drug industry because they're getting away with murder. ... Pharma has a lot of lobbies, a lot of lobbyists and a lot of power. And there's very little bidding on drugs. We’re the largest buyer of drugs in the world, and yet we don't bid properly. And were going to start bidding and were going to save billions of dollars over a period of time.

President Trump has also stressed that "dealing with big pharma price gouging" will be one of the stages in his health care plan, but we don't have any specifics about that yet.

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[–] GOMAD_OR_GFYAD 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago  (edited ago)

The core of the problem is the economics related to the production and consumption of health care is so alien compared to other products and services, and the health care industry is so huge and complex, that it is basically impossible to regulate in a way that will satisfy everyone.

There are also many reasons for why health care is really not well suited to be covered by insurance, and other reasons for why it really has to be. Insurance works by creating risk pools that share the costs of random-chance type events for the unlucky few who fall victim to those events. A premium is calculated by considering the likelihood of a claim and the likely cost of a claim for whatever it is being insured. The problem for health insurance is that so much of that is affected by the behavior and lifestyle choices of the consumer. It is also very difficult and/or expensive to acquire that data just to find a premium. Realistically they would analyze hair samples for drug use and for nutritional intake, would log all exercise and activity, give a full checkup to the person, run blood tests, etc... Then price the policy according to the results. They don't collect that data and may be prohibited from rating a policy differently because of it. They have do you smoke? Yes/no and that it. They don't have "what is your bmi?"or "do you eat your vegetables?" or "how much do you exercise?" Those would be meaningless questions anyway because the answers can not be verified and everyone would lies.

Health care costs are getting higher and higher. Many blame Obamacare or muh corparashunz, but if these have had an impact it would be more like prices went up 6% last year instead of 5%. T Before Obamacare things had gotten really bad and it was clear that some kind of reform would be needed. If Obama never became president, McCainCare would have included many things that would have been fairly similar to Obamacare. Some things must be enforced for all insurers or else no insurer will follow that rule. For example from an Obama are rule: if one insurer covered preexisting conditions but no one else did, then all the people with preexisting conditions would flock to that carrier. It would be the sickest group of policholders in the country and premiums would have to be enormous to account for that, which would drive all the people without prexisting conditions to go to other carriers for the lower rates. If preexisting conditions are covered by all then no one carrier I more burdened nu that than any other is. .

Obamaacare had some things that were stupid and some new ideas that have not panned out. It needed to be reformed and if trump had lost then clinton would have reformed it too. The reason it became "trumpcare" is because the stupid things and ideas that didn't pan out were the "new flashy and interesting" stuff in Obamacare and now trumpcare will have other things that serve as "nee flashy and interesting." In all likelihood though some of the trumpcare things will not pan out, and in 2025 there will be a reform bill to replace the failed things while leaving the successful things in place.

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[–] AlfredJProofrock 1 points 0 points (+1|-1) ago  (edited ago)

Everybody in POL works for BIG INSURANCE since 1950's when Warren Buffet changed insurance to "Maximize Premiums, Deny Claims", then re-invest insurance claims in stock-market, now 'Insurance' is the richest industry in USA, which feeds it lobbyists to FUCK the american-ppl even harder. Both DEM&PUG are involved, but PUG historically fuck's ppl economically harder.

Big Insurance Wrote Romney-Care, Big Insurance wrote Obama-Care, and Big Insurance re-wrote Trump-Care, but now that its been in effect and fucked so many ppl the politicians can't sell it any long to anybody.

Remember TRUMP said during election that he wants "SINGLE PAYER" so doesn't Insurance, with only ONE INSURANCE company left standing. Fascism - When GOV&Business become One.


RomneyCare is ObamaCare ... history. http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2015/10/23/451200436/mitt-romney-finally-takes-credit-for-obamacare

http://www.cnbc.com/2015/10/23/mitt-romney-admits-romneycare-had-to-precede-obamacare.html


Because the ORIGINAL obamacare was invented/created by ROMNEY, a republian UTAH NSA asshole

Obama-Care didn't have fuck to do with OBAMA, it was always ROMNEY-CARE, the Fox-News assholes renamed it and the name stuck.

Trump-Care was also written by insurance companys, but this time it got down-voated, as voters have made it clear to all politicians that they hate romney-care, and its derivatives.

During election, TRUMP made it clear that SINGLE-PAYER ( communalism government social medical ala UK ) was his goal, but now NY is saying single-payer will be MORE expensive than what we have now.

US medical care is fucked, and the Kosher-Mafia has no desire to make the GOY healthy in the USA, even if they steal 100% of their income.


Solution for your dad? Get the fuck out USA, go to CUBA, MEXICO, where they have ultra-cheap high quality healthcare, the USA system is not about health-care its about bankruptcy, and death.

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[–] alele-opathic [S] 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Thanks for taking a stab at this.

Remember TRUMP said during election that he wants "SINGLE PAYER"

I can't believe this is a thing, jesus fuck. Why did 'everyone' seem to have the idea that obamacare would be repealed? (At least everyone on /pol/ and most people I work with seemed to think that was the next step forward.)

And is anyone actually okay with this? Does anyone actually want to keep Obama/Ryan/Whomever Care?

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[–] sanegoatIAmNot 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Romney-Care essentially just say's that paying insurance companys is mandatory ( You don't have insurance then Pay IRS a fine ), the poor have the right to enter a hospital and seek treament, its the middle class that's fucked ( bankruptcy ), the rich by definition can fly to a country with cheap quality health-care.

Most country's on earth have single-payer, which means GOV monopoly, but also means that everybody get's taken care of,

USA is the worst system on earth, the most expensive, and the shittiest quality care, where most doctor's have to pay 60% OF THEIR GROSS just for mal-practice insurance,


Trump lied on 100% of his 'promises' like repeal obama-care, given that RNC hates Trump more than DNC, TRUMP never had a chance to pass a single law while in office.

You look at Trump EO's like 'immigration' the courts just vote-down, Thus TRUMP is a figure head, and nothing more.

100% of his promises were just campaign promises and in USA they don't mean shit.