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[–] Forgetmenot 0 points 1 point (+1|-0) ago  (edited ago)

I was always on the "America first ship" I have not wavered from putting our country first at all. I don't change my ideals because of a poll or a false flag. I can say that Trump is the one who seems to have jumped the "America first ship". There never was a "trump ship" none of the tshirts or red baseball caps carried the name trump. It said MAGA or proud deplorable. Most people voted for trump because of his agenda and they remain remain loyal to the values and ideals That won trump the election. He has surrounded himself with never trumpers. That is his choice we can blame priebus or McMaster or kushner. Trump chooses to surround himself with these people. He is in charge. I myself have remained steadfast and loyal to The "America first" values that he ran on. It is why I voted for him. Now Is trump the one who seems to be making an about face to his values and his long standing public opinions? Did he jump the America first ship? Please don't label me a shill, or a ship jumper or reacting at the first sign of adversity. In reality, It is trump who seems to be changing his values and jumping off the America first ship. I hope I am proven wrong, but I also Cant just give him the benefit of the doubt after his support of Paul Ryan and Ryan care, or how he threatened the freedom caucas, or how he fired Flynn, and now how he has publicly distanced himself from bannon? 4d chess or at these his true colors? I myself won't laugh at anyone if I am right, it's actually tragic.

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[–] SeemsReasonable ago 

Don't worry I don't think you're a shill, I know there are genuine people who have their own opinions of events just as I do. I just see things differently for the time being. I'll probably be one of the people who waits until it's too late if it turns out trump betrayed everyone (I really don't think he is or will). I considered not adding in my last line because it's generalizing too much and I won't really be laughing but figured people would read it and associate it with the shills not anyone else who has a genuine negative view of trump or his actions whether it be for good or bad reasons. It can be really hard to determine who is and is not a shill (way harder than a lot make it out to be most of the time) so mostly I give people the benefit of the doubt. There are def shills and concern trolls here though, but in how large of numbers I do not know. I think sanegoats incessant spamming of calling everyone shills has helped to water down the term to being near meaningless a lot of the time.

The people Trump has surrounded himself with does seem slightly worrying to me but all in all I'm not too worried, we'll just have to wait for time to tell how things will turn out. It might sound like I'm talking about everyone who is not a trump supporter but honestly I don't intent it that way. It just seemed suspicious to me how quickly people changed their stance based on limited info especially considering how much support Trump has had on here for a long time now but really emotional reactions are just a part of being human so I don't blame people who may have reacted too soon and I sometimes do it too. Maybe I'm the one who is wrong and in the end, I will accept and admit that and be disappointed.

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[–] Forgetmenot 0 points 1 point (+1|-0) ago 

I too don't know either. and though I have doubts about trump I am still a supporter. Thank you for not calling me a shill. On Reddit, I was called a shill, with no logic and reasonable discussion. I think the shills are trying attack independent thinkers and label them as shills. There are some redditors who are vicious and fanatical in their "support" of trump. They attack Ann coulter, Michael savage, cernovich, Paul Joseph watson, in the same style of shills and trolls. There is just something about shills, their content seems false and they resort to name calling or disparaging and marginalizing comments. These shills also get instantly upvoated. I am not a die hard savage fan or Ann coulter fan, but I do not believe they became shills overnight. I too am waiting and seeing, i have read some interesting opposing points of view and I remain cautiously optimistic. The shills play many sides of the fence. I believe there are shills pushing the military industrial complex and a Syrian escalation disguised as trump supporters, there are shills working to push oil and Saudi interestsdisguised as SJW and Liberals, there are shills for big pharma and health care interests, this is not counting the David Brock shills protecting the democrats we have all seen the I used to be a trump supporter script. I have seen shills work to help the image of a billionaire (not trump) who was facing an indictment. There are many special interests right now and there is a lot of money to be made and public relations is important to get these special interests passed. I tend to question everything.