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[–] bannana 31 points 141 points (+172|-31) ago 

Is there another source for this? Your link is not exactly the pinnacle of reliable journalism.

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[–] flyawayhigh 12 points 73 points (+85|-12) ago  (edited ago)

Yes, there are other sources. Here is an example article touching upon both sides.


Edit: TY @VictorOscarAlphaTang for forcing me to take a closer look at this situation.

Given your challenge I have searched around and 2014 numbers have simply not been released that I can find. I did find quite a few articles saying that the numbers at Breitbart are not accurate. Since Breitbart cites GAO as its source, I would like to see this source.

Getting Immigration Facts Straight

No, undocumented immigrants are not tied to 50% of Texas murders

The Political Exploitation Of One Undocumented Murderer which includes this PDF study

I also found this comprehensive chart but it doesn't break out immigrants. :(

Bottom line... nobody seems to know. If anyone has good numbers, put them up. I suppose there are numbers for 2013 around, but not likely for 2014 yet.

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[–] 1662410 5 points 43 points (+48|-5) ago  (edited ago)

According to the article you linked illegal aliens account for 9.2% of federal murder convictions. The article you linked also notes that federal convictions account for a very small percentage of all violent convictions so are not a representative sample. According to the Breitbart article, illegal aliens account for more than 30% of all murder convictions in many states. So it is not a case of Breitbart cherry-picking federal crimes.

[–] [deleted] 2 points 26 points (+28|-2) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] joethebob 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

BB seemingly got the numbers from [James Simpson] and he apparently got them from a FOAA request with the GAO. (http://tomohalloran.com/2015/07/08/illegal-alien-advocates-accessories-to-an-epidemic-of-murder-and-child-rape/) If he published any of this information directly I cannot find it, so it would appear he presents his analysis only.

To contextualize with slightly older data of the same type: http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d11187.pdf

"Arizona, California, Florida, New York, and Texas" - We selected these five states because they are the states with the largest number of SCAAP criminal aliens.

Percentage of State Illegal Alien prison population convicted on homicide / illegal population / derived number of homicides.

AZ CA FL NY TX
4% 9% 8% 27% 9%
18,357 102,121 16,935 13,192 36,065
734 9191 1355 3562 3246

Of course all these numbers would represent a cumulative figure over and indeterminate number of years so it's not all that useful on a per year basis. You could of course extrapolate some minimum sentence lengths to get a potential upper bound on a yearly figure.

For perspective on the raw numbers:
General homicide rate by state per 100,000 pop (2007 fbi figure) / pop in 100,000's (2010) / derived homicides for 2007

AZ CA FL NY TX
7.4 6.2 6.6 4.2 5.9
63.92 372.54 188.01 193.78 251.46
473 2310 1241 814 1484

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[–] KleanRider 1 points 1 points (+2|-1) ago 

The same can be said for pretty much every news source out there including NPR.

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[–] explorevoat [S] 20 points 62 points (+82|-20) ago  (edited ago)

These are partly federal statistics, are you kidding? Go to .gov? Wow, suddenly the feds are lying to everyone here, and their statistics are faked to make illegals look bad?

--edit-- my post history is being brigaded after I made this post. We have some serious SJW/astroturf people here now that were not 8 weeks ago. This is just fucked. I post this article then watch my history and interests (that have nothing to do with this) gather downvoats. SRS is here. If you are doing that have the intestinal fortitude to comment or PM me and we can have a discussion. Seriously leave a comment or PM, or you know you'll lose the discussion, or won't own your actions?

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[–] Gable 4 points 13 points (+17|-4) ago 

Clicked on your .gov link, nothing happened. Must be something wrong with that source.

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[–] bannana 2 points 10 points (+12|-2) ago 

federal statistics

then why not supply that link then, skippy? why post an intentionally biased source and then get pissy when you are called out? If these are legitimate numbers it should be a piece of cake to post a link that backs it up.

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[–] Dysnomia 4 points 10 points (+14|-4) ago 

Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kent. 14% of people know that.

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[–] boater 3 points 4 points (+7|-3) ago  (edited ago)

How do we know that illegal aliens are actually commiting all of these crimes, and are not simply subject to high rates of conviction because the police and prosecutors know they are a vulnerable portion of the population which they can pin anything on when they need to close a case?

For instance, the following police officer was caught for molesting and raping 20 illegal immigrants:

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/officer-year-admits-raping-20-male-immigrants-charged-sex-offender/

It shows that their undocumented status makes them targets which officers know they can abuse.

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[–] explorevoat [S] 4 points 4 points (+8|-4) ago  (edited ago)

Yes, it has been covered by USA today but in a very "politically correct" way, to cover up how incredibly disproportionate it is per capita. There are what? 12 million illegals? They sure are involved in a lot of murder cases that rise to the federal level for being such a small part of the population. Also, somehow the USA deported all illegals in the 1920s and 1930s but cannot do it now, what a joke. Wait until it touches someone you know.

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[–] Dysnomia 3 points 3 points (+6|-3) ago 

I know a few people who would say 99.99% of all murders in the US are committed by illegals.

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[–] moonroof- 1 points -1 points (+0|-1) ago 

What exactly do you piece of shit faggot liberal consider reliable journalism? CNN aka CUNT News Network?

[–] [deleted] 6 points 48 points (+54|-6) ago  (edited ago)

[Deleted]

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[–] boater 8 points 27 points (+35|-8) ago 

Somebody's doing the raping, for instance the following Florida police officer was caught for molesting and raping 20 undocumented immigrants:

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/officer-year-admits-raping-20-male-immigrants-charged-sex-offender/

Undocumented immigrants are a highly vulnerable portion of the population because they can be continually threatened with deportation and often have a poor grasp of the law and language.

It's not clear whether they are actually committing high rates of murder or if police and prosecutors are simply more like to name them as suspects in order to get higher rates of conviction.

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[–] sneakybells 2 points 6 points (+8|-2) ago 

Another interesting thing to take into perspective is, nationally, we have a solve rate of 30 percent on murders and in some places, like chicago, it's as high as 70%.

I also don't know how poverty isn't being brought up. Naturally if you have a whole group of people and make them poor, there's going to disproportionate amount of crime on their side compared to their richer counterparts. Poverty breeds desperation.

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[–] A_Fringe_Element 1 points 5 points (+6|-1) ago 

Undocumented immigrants are a highly vulnerable portion of the population

Sounds like it's not a good idea to come here then.

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[–] the_spectre 5 points 1 points (+6|-5) ago  (edited ago)

Maybe I'll register republican and burn my vote on Trump. Kind of like I burned it on Vermin Supreme 2012.

Edit: jeez, guys. I'm joking. Should have used a /s.

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[–] Bathroom_Humor 4 points -1 points (+3|-4) ago 

It makes me sad that my brother is actually defending Trump, trying to make him seem like a valid contender for president. At first I thought he was just kidding. Turns out my brother doesn't care that this is stereotyping. :/ sad times.

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[–] ScrotBallBaggins 2 points 6 points (+8|-2) ago 

It's great. The guy can't actually win. All he's going to do is splinter the right and fuck the entire GOP

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[–] Groomzilla 1 points 1 points (+2|-1) ago 

He's thinking for himself...

That's truly unfortunate

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[–] uberdoober 18 points 36 points (+54|-18) ago  (edited ago)

The illegal alien issue definitely should not be downplayed as something only mean old Mr Trump talks about. Tomorrow it could be your wife, daughter, or son who is raped or killed by someone who jumped the border and has little regard for our laws and American way of life. I'd love to see someone in the media spotlight take it to the next level and insist those who hire these illegals face stiff penalties. Maybe someday, someday it might happen.

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[–] MrPim 5 points 30 points (+35|-5) ago 

I'd love to see Trump take it to the next level and insist those who hire these illegals face stiff penalties.

He'd have to replace most of his own restaurant/hotel staff.

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[–] uberdoober 1 points 16 points (+17|-1) ago 

Exactly! I know I'm day dreaming but if there were no jobs for the illegals they would either be forced to apply for citizenship like others have done. Let me tell you, those I know who have personally done the whole routine to get US citizenship the legal way are burning mad about those who sneak in illegally and are hired for super low wages and paid under the table. It hurts wages for those who follow the law and do it properly.

[–] [deleted] 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] RumbledFeathers 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

I get that you're joking but I doubt any of trump's employees are illegal aliens. That is only done at non chain, very low tier restaurants. But thanks for showing again how being disingenuous and lying are the main tools of people too stupid to argue real factual points. You should be a writer for the daily show so all the stupid sheep can laugh at your "hilarious" comment.

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[–] gmon 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

He probably does a lot of outsourcing. IMO, that's the point. Essentially what he's saying is that trade deals and pro-immigrant policies have lead to outsourcing of jobs and importing labor because it's cheaper. Being a businessman, he's going to do what is profitable for his business, as any businessman does. But he also knows the reasons why businesses outsource, and if you don't like the outsourcing of jobs, you need to make it more profitable to keep jobs in the U.S.

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[–] novictim 0 points 5 points (+5|-0) ago 

That was a breath of fresh air.

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[–] Calith 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

What about the American rapers and killers? They have more regard for "our" laws and "American" way of life?

Please. Rapers and killers are rapers and killers- no matter the nationality. Turning it into an Us vs Them thing just is trying to lay problems at someone else's feet to make yourself feel superior.

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[–] uberdoober 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

American rapists and killers don't get to walk away with a slap on the wrist again and again like the illegal aliens do. American citizens get prison time, illegals get deported and come right back over the border again.

It must be nice to have a sheltered little life where nobody you've ever met has been raped by an illegal. It must be peachy to not have to worry about if your car will be totaled by a drunk illegal who will get a slap on the wrist instead of a DUI charge, all while you lose your sole mode of transportation that is key to your ability to earn a living and support a family. Enjoy that little politically correct bubble world while it lasts because sooner or later reality will come knocking.

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[–] uberdoober 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

Nah, but I like how you think we should bow down to and feel sorry for the people who piss upon on immigration system and shatter the lives of innocent Americans.

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[–] johnlocke90 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

I'd love to see someone in the media spotlight take it to the next level and insist those who hire these illegals face stiff penalties.

In some states that is the law. Texas has laws punishing people who hire illegals and they had a significant positive impact.

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[–] BoiseNTheHood 7 points 30 points (+37|-7) ago 

#DeportEveryIllegal

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[–] chalbersma 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

There's no hastag (#) type functionality on voat is there? Why the hashtag?

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[–] Wmb102er 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

Kids these days.

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[–] battle 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

I could only really get behind that if I knew they wouldn't use it as an excuse to search my house for illegals or some shit.

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[–] sombravetado 5 points -1 points (+4|-5) ago  (edited ago)

#ArresteveryRepublicancorporateexecutivewhohiresillegals

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[–] BrownMoses 0 points 8 points (+8|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Why just the Republican ones? Plenty of Democrat Corporate Executives who love hiring illegals.

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[–] 1Sorry_SOB 3 points 23 points (+26|-3) ago  (edited ago)

While you may look askance at Breitbart, the truth is the paper of record, NYT, will never print a story that doesn't fawn over immigrants. So they are not very reliable either.

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[–] bagano1 5 points 22 points (+27|-5) ago 

Most New Yorkers are absolute hypocrites. They are the biggest libtards around, but if any minority walks behind them on the street, they get scared as hell and wet their pants.

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[–] 1Sorry_SOB 4 points 19 points (+23|-4) ago 

They like the idea of minorities, just not the reality.

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[–] RewriteFullwise 6 points 9 points (+15|-6) ago 

That's the essence of the liberal mind.

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[–] TruthSemen 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

It's such a shame that the fourth estate is effectively dead. The media only parrots what its constituencies want to hear. It's an awful state of affairs.

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[–] lolsociety 8 points 21 points (+29|-8) ago  (edited ago)

I'm pretty surprised to see so many bigots on voat. Living in what amounts to a "sanctuary city," in Texas (Houston), our city is full of undocumented immigrants and the vast majority are busting their asses to provide for their family and grateful for the opportunity. Crime is pretty equally distributed, our news stations have a hard-on for reporting crime and rarely is an "illegal alien," the one being reported on.

Plus isn't this the definition of prejudice? Judging an entire group on the actions of a few? Calling for deportation of masses for what people they've never met have done.

I believe pretty adamantly humans have the right to migrate. We're a migratory species, always have been, always will be. Laws against migration are like laws against plants; imaginary man-made laws that contradict natural law. We are earthlings. This is our lands. Punish people if they commit real crimes.

I guarantee if you had kids and you were growing up in a country stricken with incredible poverty, and violence created by the US's drug war, you would do whatever it takes to get somewhere safe where you can provide for your children. Where is the damn empathy?

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[–] HelmedHorror 4 points 11 points (+15|-4) ago 

You can empathize while also recognizing the impossibility of open borders. If the United States allowed anyone and everyone to enter the country, the United States would look like a third world country in a very short number of years. It's already heading that way.

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[–] lolsociety 7 points 3 points (+10|-7) ago 

And why do you believe that others should be stuck in dangerous situations so that you can feel safer? Especially when US policies are largely responsible for the situations in those countries?

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[–] HW14 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

I completely disagree. I believe the news reports only a small fraction of the real crime in the city. You can just check the Harris County/ City of Houston crime statistics for that. Most murders and robberies do not get reported on, especially if they involve a Illegal alien. I think this is because the cannot ever get any real information or investigation going so there isn't really anything to report on.

Instead of getting upset at us Americans who have to pay with money, crime, congestion, poor quality schools, etc. for these illegal aliens, please focus your efforts on their home countries where they should be working to improve their countries.

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[–] lolsociety 1 points 6 points (+7|-1) ago 

The biggest way conditions could improve over there is ending the drug war here.

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[–] wrongway 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago  (edited ago)

I had a friend who was a detective and he said he would much rather work with black gang bangers than Hispanics because Hispanics would never turn on their own. It didn't matter if someone raped their child, they would never cooperate with the police. I guess coming from Latin America where the police are really corrupt and as likely to rob you as help you, I suppose it makes sense.

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[–] Patranus 1 points 4 points (+5|-1) ago  (edited ago)

Texas spends >12 billion dollars per year on illegal aliens. Remember that every time you hit a pot hole, wait at your DMV, can't afford to pay teachers, ect.

As a resident of Texas you directly pay $450 per year to subsidize illegal aliens. (Assuming you pay any meaningful taxes)

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[–] barrinmw 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago  (edited ago)

I believe Texas was the state that came out with a report showing that undocumented immigrants generate more economic action than they cost.

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[–] lolsociety 1 points 2 points (+3|-1) ago 

8.5 billion of that is education. The horror.

I looked at the report. It exists to fill an agenda, and it relies on extrapolating information and spinning statistics. For example the 8.5 billion does not come from how much the education budget increases per x,000 immigrants. Instead, they take the total Texas education budget, estimate how many students are illegal, and multiply that rate by the total education budget. That doesn't seem like a very honest way of coming up with numbers.

Anyway, $450 a year? Okay. I'll pay that. If me being $450 richer means kids being stuck in violent countries, or being denied an education because they were taken by their parents to safety, or being turned away at the emergency room, etc, I'd have to be of a completely self-centered, greedy mind-state to think "not on my dime. I've got pot holes that need fixed."

I also want to point out that a lot of the costs shift onto the public are shifted onto the public because being undocumented makes it harder for them to be successful. I think the tax base from immigrants would grow immensely if they were documented and allowed equal opportunity. And at the same time, American wages would go up because employers couldn't give their jobs to people they can pay below the minimum wage.

[–] [deleted] 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] lolsociety 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

Well I was more talking about the responses to the post. But anyway, stats can be represented bigotedly.

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[–] MrPim 7 points 12 points (+19|-7) ago 

I have a hard time buying this. Unless you're talking about a specific subset of murders. Most murders are by people you know. So, unless this is about random crime/robbery type stats, I can't believe this. If you are talking about robberies which went bad and people got killed, ok maybe. But that's not 30% of murders.

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[–] MonitoredCitizen 3 points 8 points (+11|-3) ago 

Another statistic you won't see on the nightly news is that illegal aliens account for about 95% of all manual agricultural labor performed in the US, and do it for well below minimum wage.

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[–] HelmedHorror 2 points 5 points (+7|-2) ago 

That's just a stereotype. Only 5% of illegal immigrants work in agriculture/forestry/mining, and only 1/6th of that industry's workers are illegal immigrants.

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[–] 1Sorry_SOB 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

We don't need 50 million people to pick lettuce.

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[–] HoneyNutStallmans 1 points 6 points (+7|-1) ago  (edited ago)

only 1/6th of that industry's workers are illegal immigrants.

"only"

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