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[–] mountainvoat 6 points 664 points (+670|-6) ago  (edited ago)

Atko: thanks for what you've done here.

I hope you realize how important Voat is to the idea of free and open discussion.

edit: and congratulations on your incorporation!

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[–] Arotaes_Forgehammer 1 points 120 points (+121|-1) ago 

It's gonna be a fun ride from here on out.

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[–] SongAboutYourPost 3 points 33 points (+36|-3) ago 

that'd be a good song.

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[–] bangorbuck 7 points 23 points (+30|-7) ago 

buckle up!

1 reply

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[–] SongAboutYourPost 0 points 7 points (+7|-0) ago 

Song About Your Quote: https://soundcloud.com/songsaboutyourpost/its-gonna-be-a-fun-ride-from-here-on-out

That was a lot of fun! head over to /v/SongAboutYourPost to see all the crap and feel free to summon good ol' /u/SongAboutYourPost whenever.

1 reply

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[–] toxicass 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Yup, I completely support your right to allow us to discuss things that need discussion. As long as preying on children is reported and stamped out.

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[–] pickelz4 2 points 36 points (+38|-2) ago 

It's not Voat it's Voat, Inc. now!

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[–] Klaue 2 points 35 points (+37|-2) ago 

Voatinc sounds like a nice robot name, maybe someone should redesign the voat goat into the Voat, Inc Goatbot

9 replies

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[–] king_of_the_universe 1 points 26 points (+27|-1) ago 

I'm upvoatinc this.

1 reply

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[–] Sacrix 2 points 12 points (+14|-2) ago 

Voat, Inc. is no longer a student side project but a corporation registered in the U.S.

Thanks to things like the Patriot Act, Voat is subject to horribly backwards laws that would force it to give up certain information under gag orders.

Choosing the US, of all places... Yeah, the hugbox here may like it, but I certainly don't, and this is effective now the end of my membership here. Bye.

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[–] Dresser 2 points 4 points (+6|-2) ago 

You are ending your membership because they established themselves in the U.S ? Something tells me you never actually left Reddit

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[–] NotAnOctopus 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

I noticed you only reference these backwards laws vaguely because you probably learned about them on reddit. Other countries almost certainly have ones that are just as bad, you just haven't heard about them because they don't have the same protections that allow us to openly talk about them.

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[–] babajee 1 points 3 points (+4|-1) ago 

I hope they stay strong! Many companies start with free speech... but after becoming larger corporations only remember the smell of the dollar!

1 reply

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[–] jaschac 7 points 367 points (+374|-7) ago 

U.S. law by far beats every other candidate country we’ve researched.

Well, that's a mildly terrifying thought. :\

But the important take-away from this: Congratulations on the milestone! Looking forward to seeing Voat grow. :)

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[–] Bathroom_Humor 7 points 129 points (+136|-7) ago 

For reals. The U.S. isn't constantly going around shutting down sites like this, but I don't think it is the ultimate in freedom of speech or expression... If they find SOME reason (doesn't need to be a good one) to apply pressure to Atko and co, they will do it until they get what they want. Federal Seizure without warning can happen. I just hope it never will!

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[–] SuperConductiveRabbi 4 points 189 points (+193|-4) ago  (edited ago)

The reason the Federal government doesn't shut down sites is because the vast majority of sites comply with the orders to give the government backdoors. Only the companies that don't are the ones that get shut down, and the CEOs end up in prison for unrelated crimes that the government just mysteriously gets evidence for.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qwest#Refusal_of_NSA_surveillance_requests

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavabit#Suspension_and_gag_order

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/20/why-did-lavabit-shut-down-snowden-email

They'll come for Voat, either legally or with a forged cert that lets them sniff the traffic via one of their Internet backbone wiretaps. They'll know the IP addresses of every poster that criticizes the US government, just like Reddit.

8 replies

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[–] Klaue 3 points 63 points (+66|-3) ago 

The thing is, name a better one. Germany, where you have to absolutely prove your visitors are 18+ to serve any sort of adult content? GB where female orgasm is illegal? etc.
Only place would probably be Sealand and I don't know if they can be trusted with something like this.

Also sad is that Atko probably has to transfer ownership, because as far as I remember, swiss law states that it doesn't matter where the server is, if the guy owning it is swiss, swiss laws apply to it and therefore him

10 replies

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[–] BobbyTables 0 points 11 points (+11|-0) ago 

They need to establish a Warrant Canary NOW! I'll echo what some others have noted. I think there are far better choices than the U.S. to run a site like Voat right now. Canada, Finland, Norway, Iceland, Sweden or even Hong Kong would have been better choices. U.S. law enforcement atmosphere is antithetical to what I understood to be the spirit of Voat. I hope I'm wrong, but this seems to be a poor decision at this point.

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[–] ScienceCat 1 points 8 points (+9|-1) ago 

The Feds only seize sites suspected to be hosting pirated files or breaking copyright as far as I know. I've never heard of them seizing a social media site. I don't think Voat has to be worried about any of that as long as they maintain a hands-off approach with their userbase.

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[–] rwbj 4 points 44 points (+48|-4) ago 

Why? While there is certainly a private sector attack on free speech happening in the US, it's one of the few constitutional rights the government continues to support almost without exception. One of the most recent rulings was Snyder v Phelps related to the Westboro Baptist Church. The supreme court upheld the right of a church members to picket about 1000 feet from a military funeral with signs stating things like "God Hates the USA/Thank God for 9/11", "Thank God for IEDs”, “Thank God for Dead Soldiers,” “Priests Rape Boys,” “God Hates Fags”, and so on. They were sued for among other things the intentional infliction of emotional distress. The supreme court voted 8-1 in favor of the picketers. I suppose the fact it had to make it to the supreme court is disconcerting, but for now at least it wasn't even close to an issue.

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[–] InnocentBystander 1 points 35 points (+36|-1) ago 

it's one of the few constitutional rights the government continues to support

I guess that's the fear. While they have done well with speech, they have wiped their ass with other rights (eg. privacy). How long until free speech helps terrorists? They also have a history of manipulating and suppressing information despite any laws to protect it.

I don't really have any better options. But I feel that while this may be the 'best' option, it's not really a good one.

4 replies

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[–] TheBuddha 1 points 16 points (+17|-1) ago 

Ha! I had guessed (and almost typed) that Alito would be the lone voice of dissent. I figured I would follow your link to see. Sure enough, Alito and his dissent... I did not bother to read it. Wow, I really hate Alito. At least he acted exactly as I expected him to. It allows me to hate him and feel good about it.

Note that I do not, by any means, support WBC. I abhor their actions beyond belief. However, I strongly support their right to say what ever they want. I would not go out of my way to commit a crime but, if they happened to be where I was, I would happily pay the fine and do the weekend in jail just and feel good about it - after punching one of them in the face multiple times.

I am not a very good Buddhist but, in my defense, I am not a monk. Phillip Phelps really needs a good crack in the jaw. General Principle (and his army of ants) has determined this to be true. I support their right to say whatever they want. I support my freedom to crack them in the jaw. (Note: Rights and freedoms are not even remotely the same. I am free to kill you. I do not have a right to kill you.)

3 replies

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[–] Walther 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

There is a catch though. There was no money to be made there, so the ruling was probably fair and nobody was pressured to do anything. When it comes to sites like voat that make it easy for people to find real news, leaks etc. there are many parties who want to control the outcome and suddenly that 8-1 ruling turns into a 1-8 ruling. That is what i'm scared of, but i can also understand that Atko took the best option available.

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[–] sergeant_skip 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

I'm really curious who wrote the dissenting opinion, but too lazy to look it up myself.

1 reply

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[–] Rea11yN0tMe 0 points 5 points (+5|-0) ago  (edited ago)

The US is one of the rare western countries that has no 'hate speech' laws on the book. And thanks to the constitution, that is not going to change either:

Traditionally, however, if the speech did not fall within one of the above categorical exceptions, it was protected speech. In 1969, the Supreme Court protected a Ku Klux Klan member’s racist and hate-filled speech and created the ‘imminent danger’ test to permit hate speech. The court ruled in Brandenburg v. Ohio that; "The constitutional guarantees of free speech and free press do not permit a state to forbid or proscribe advocacy of the use of force, or of law violation except where such advocacy is directed to inciting imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#United_States

Compare that to the other countries in the Wikipedia article and what passes as freedom to speak your mind there.

Edit: 'Freeze peach', as American as apple pie!

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[–] Stanley_Yelnats_IV 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

It's unfortunately true. As much as free speech has been under attack in the US lately, almost everywhere else is much worse. To the best of my knowledge, the US is in fact the only developed country that doesn't ban "hate speech;" in other words, it's the only place left where you can't be thrown in jail for offending someone.

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[–] CosmicSans 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Most countries do not have a free speech guarantee in their constitution or analogous governing document.

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[–] 1535518? 3 points 184 points (+187|-3) ago 

Some people are going to be seriously pissed about it being registered in the U.S but it's your website.

[–] [deleted] 6 points 90 points (+96|-6) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] 1536249? 4 points 95 points (+99|-4) ago 

Avoid all US and UK based services

Yeah, for storing secret information. For posting public posts that will be public anyway, for whatever "privacy" means in the context of Voat, it could incorporate in and operate from wherever.

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[–] ketsuban 2 points 15 points (+17|-2) ago 

The servers are still in Switzerland. Being registered as a corporation in the US is something completely different.

4 replies

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[–] bigfondue 1 points 0 points (+1|-1) ago 

A VPN site trying to sell you services isn't the best thing to cite IMO.

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[–] MCVoat 1 points 22 points (+23|-1) ago 

Why would people be pissed?

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[–] Gigan 1 points 89 points (+90|-1) ago 

NSA.

9 replies

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[–] CowWithBeef 0 points 18 points (+18|-0) ago 

Gag orders make it hard to know exactly what the government has done to reduce liberty on the website.

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[–] taco 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

If you host content/incorporated in US, then you have to bend to DCMA requests, MPAA... NSA... there are many many groups (not all government either) that have interest in castrating a place like voat.

[–] [deleted] 5 points 1 points (+6|-5) ago 

[Deleted]
2 replies

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[–] nonethewiser 1 points 6 points (+7|-1) ago 

The kid wants investor money. Best way to get that is to incorporate in the US.

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[–] WolfPackNigga 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

dat Silicon Valley, my nigga

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[–] Arotaes_Forgehammer 1 points 0 points (+1|-1) ago 

The kid? I thought he was a squid!

2 replies

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[–] Arotaes_Forgehammer 1 points 4 points (+5|-1) ago 

Tru dat. It's his money, he can do whatever the hell he wants with it.

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[–] MCVoat 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

What if he has a structured settlement but he needs cash now?

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[–] DanielFlamino 3 points 92 points (+95|-3) ago 

Voat Achievement Unlocked!

The American Dream

Dunno, I'm bored. :P

raises glass

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[–] JuliusSeizure 1 points 35 points (+36|-1) ago 

Fuck yeah.

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[–] Maskedsaturn 0 points 10 points (+10|-0) ago 

Dammit, Julius!

1 reply

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[–] OmicronPersei8 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

The American Dream by George Carlin

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[–] ratzp0li 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhnUgAaea4M

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[–] Redeyedjedi 0 points 82 points (+82|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Thanks for the great forum, and the hardwork that went into it.

My question now, is did you see the post about selling shares to users? Have you considrred this option? Because while donating to voat is one thing, i would put down a lot more money, and effort in promoting your site if it were possible to own even just a fractionbof a percent of it.

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[–] Atko [S] 0 points 140 points (+140|-0) ago 

Hi, yes, I saw the post and I am definitely for offering a portion of Voat shares to the users. We're still discussing this option and personally I think this would be a very good move, provided we cap the number of shares a single user could purchase in the first round so that everyone could get an equal chance. We'll see.

[–] [deleted] 0 points 37 points (+37|-0) ago 

[Deleted]
1 reply

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[–] Redeyedjedi 0 points 14 points (+14|-0) ago 

Awesome. That's great to hear. Thanks for the reply. And everything else. You're doing an amazing job.

[–] [deleted] 0 points 8 points (+8|-0) ago  (edited ago)

[Deleted]
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[–] Gone_Private 0 points 7 points (+7|-0) ago 

I would be very interested in obtaining shares.

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[–] mudcatca 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

I'm for this as well!

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[–] MadJack 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

I am also interested.

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[–] No_Regretzky 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

This all makes sense and can work but then Voat will be bound to shareholders. Voat won't only need to make money for themselves and to make the site work, they will need to accountable to their shareholders.

This can be good and bad:

Good: the shareholders with have more power and there is a better incentive to make this site popular Bad: The shareholders will be users but we can't control who those people are. Big companies can easily buy shares and control this site. Some users will buy shares as an investment and will see this as a money making opportunity and won't have the same values that some people would like this site to go.

just warning you on what may happen if part of the site does "go public"

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[–] DontTipTheVoatBaby 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

Valid points. As much as I would like to be a Voat shareholder, I wouldn't want Voat to have to consider the opinions and investments of countless people (with vastly different definitions of "success" for this site) when making any/all decisions. I can't help but think it would taint the free speech nature upon which it was founded. Hehehe...I said "taint".

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[–] gbj1301 0 points 60 points (+60|-0) ago 

You are welcome to move to Iceland when IMMI comes into law here :)

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[–] InternetUser 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

Interesting. I'm looking forward to seeing how this goes.

[–] [deleted] 7 points 49 points (+56|-7) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] Arkhound 6 points 32 points (+38|-6) ago 

Expensive to live, not have storage. Left/Right wingedness has no effect on something like this. SJW advocacy is moot (hue). SF bay area is really the best place to host for pricing/reliability in the U.S.

[–] [deleted] 6 points 33 points (+39|-6) ago 

[Deleted]
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[–] glugglug 0 points 5 points (+5|-0) ago 

No. Even Silicon Valley based companies do not have data centers there, as it would be too expensive.

Best pricing is in the middle of nowhere, in areas with hydroelectric power, like Colorado.

[–] [deleted] 0 points 14 points (+14|-0) ago 

[Deleted]

[–] [deleted] 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

[Deleted]
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[–] TheShnig 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Nice. Chattanooga, TN has municipal fiber as another inexpensive alternative. I think they and RTP benefit from far lower costs of living and real estate prices.

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[–] hexydes 0 points 5 points (+5|-0) ago 

Texas has some good options (Austin). Seattle is also home to some big tech (Microsoft, Valve). On the east coast you have Boston with MIT. Short of that, just find yourself a college with a good Comp Sci program and is business/startup friendly. San Francisco is nice and obviously the hub of tech, but it's not without its problems (cost of living, echo chamber community) so I would agree with OP, there are other places besides Silicon Valley that you can and should explore.

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[–] Ina_Pickle 0 points 10 points (+10|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Chattanooga, TN has the fastest internet in the entire country, and also nearly the fastest in the world.

No one thinks of Chattanooga, but it is a great little city and very tech friendly. Not to mention MUCH cheaper than San Fran.

2 replies

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[–] unsweetenedsoymilk 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

I have a programmer friend who works for a banking data center Arizona. He mentioned to me some time ago that many of the banks were thinking about relocating their data centers there due to favorable conditions. Seems like Apple and Microsoft are building data centers there too. I wonder which state did Atko incorporated Voat.co in? Because the last time I checked Nevada, Delaware and one other state (I forgot which one) were the best places (financially, ease and supportive/favorable laws) to do it.

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[–] GarrioValere 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

+1 for Phoenix

[–] [deleted] 1 points 31 points (+32|-1) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] SterlingItachiArcher 2 points 14 points (+16|-2) ago 

Our time on Voat has come to an early end it seems.

Know of any alternatives? Diaspora?

[–] [deleted] 2 points 3 points (+5|-2) ago 

[Deleted]
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[–] sweetholymosiah 1 points 2 points (+3|-1) ago 

Free speech is still a thing in the states. Maybe not privacy, but this is a public board!

1 reply

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[–] bigfondue 0 points 8 points (+8|-0) ago 

Considering that Iceland was the home of the original Silk Road, and cooperated secretly with the US for the investigation, I don't think that its the haven you think it is. Also porn is illegal there. http://icelandreview.com/news/2015/08/02/iceland-porn-ban-outdated

[–] [deleted] 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago  (edited ago)

[Deleted]
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[–] mukt 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

150 year old law that outlaws making & distributing porn there, but not viewing it.
Also, erotica seems entirely legal, judging from the article you linked.

[–] [deleted] 1 points 5 points (+6|-1) ago 

[Deleted]

[–] [deleted] 0 points 11 points (+11|-0) ago 

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