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[–] FitMachoNaziAtheist [S] 5 points 109 points (+114|-5) ago 

One more thing. Four weeks ago, when /she first made her request for AskVoat, there were over 20 older requests waiting evaluation. Hers was given priority and marked as "pending approval" within the hour, while the others remained ignored for over 10 days.

This was a coordinated power grab.

I don't know if @Atko condones any of this, but if he doesn't, he's being played. Everything he's worked for the last 2 years is being hijacked and turned into a game for petty tyrants who like to collect subs like pokemon cards, and /she just got the biggest prize.

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[–] CptCmdrAwesome 1 points 45 points (+46|-1) ago 

One more thing. Four weeks ago, when /she first made her request for AskVoat, there were over 20 older requests waiting evaluation. Hers was given priority and marked as "pending approval" within the hour, while the others remained ignored for over 10 days.

Wow ... I did not know this. Do you have the links to hand?

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[–] FitMachoNaziAtheist [S] 1 points 65 points (+66|-1) ago  (edited ago)

Sure, the special treatment is so blatantly obvious it hurts.

Go to /v/subverserequest, order by New, go to the page where she's request is listed. Look at the time difference between submission and moe's response.

She's request was answered in 46 minutes. Requests days older than /she's went unanswered for over 10 days. Her request wasn't part of a small batch of requests evaluated. Her request was the only one evaluated during a long period of time.

Example:

This is she's request. Hover over "26 days" and you'll see the time of submission: 3:33 AM. At the very bottom is moe's response, posted at 4:19 AM. Time difference: 46 minutes.

Now pick any request older than she's. Date of submission: 7/22/15. Date of moe's response? 11 days later.

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[–] heili 1 points 11 points (+12|-1) ago 

I haven't really seen @moe do things because moe favors certain individuals.

What I have seen is that moe tends to help pretty much anyone who directly asks moe for help.

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[–] kendamagendale 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

This is why I never believed in Voat...

Reddit started beating Digg because it had a new, better interface.

Voat is a clone, and vulnerable to the same abuses reddit was.

It's just less top down.

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[–] SuperConductiveRabbi 1 points 0 points (+1|-1) ago 

20 older requests for AskVoat, or 20 older requests in general?

If it's the former, it's a violation of their rules. If it's the latter, it's "only" evidence that Moe and She had some form of additional communication that got her faster service.

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[–] FitMachoNaziAtheist [S] 2 points 3 points (+5|-2) ago  (edited ago)

Went back to reddit, voat is no different.

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[–] moe 6 points 1 points (+7|-6) ago 

I think there were actually something like ten more pages at the time, can't remember. Sometimes I just flag whatever request pops up on my front page or ones that people message me about \_(o_o)_/ it doesn't get them transferred any faster or anything; transfers are done chronologically. I did the same for /v/Holocaust, some porn subs and something about plants, IIRC.

If it's the former, it's a violation of their rules.

Even had he created the request beforehand (he didn't), as I've stated here to @nomerasques before his request, we'd always been giving level-2 Moderators priority in subverse requests. This is nothing new, and the FAQ needs to be updated regarding this.

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[–] Scandinavian 2 points 40 points (+42|-2) ago  (edited ago)

Holy shit. This is literally a body on the table-damning evidence.

Edit: I was blocked for submitting content directly after replying to Puttitout. Then he sent me a PM asking if I was okay with "PM"'ing. I find this highly suspicious.

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[–] Crensch 0 points 16 points (+16|-0) ago 

Never let the wounded gazelle take it to PMs. That's just another way to hide the discussion from prying eyes.

Then all you have are screenshots that they can claim are doctored.

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[–] Scandinavian 0 points 12 points (+12|-0) ago  (edited ago)

I was annoyed by the block. But @Rea11yN0tMe is a champ and helped me get the post up instead. See here: https://voat.co/v/ProtectVoat/comments/426375

BTW: I announced in a PM to another mod that I'd submit a post. Then boom, Puttitout PM'ed me and I was blocked.

Think that's co-incidental? It could be. It also couldn't be.

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[–] mr_skeltal 1 points 12 points (+13|-1) ago 

Keep us posted with regards to your edit.

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[–] Scandinavian 0 points 17 points (+17|-0) ago  (edited ago)

I am still blocked, PM to Puttitout unanswered.

Edit: Half an hour later. Still blocked. No answer.

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[–] CptCmdrAwesome 0 points 7 points (+7|-0) ago  (edited ago)

Edit: I was blocked for submitting content directly after replying to Puttitout. Then he sent me a PM asking if I was okay with "PM"'ing. I find this highly suspicious.

You're not the only one. What the fuck.

Edit: not the only one to find this suspicious

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[–] Scandinavian 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

You are, too?!

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[–] Atko 9 points 29 points (+38|-9) ago 

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[–] FFX01 2 points 37 points (+39|-2) ago 

I understand what you're trying to say, but here's the issue as I see it:

Regardless of she's ability to mod, her moral standings, or her group of friends, it was made very clear that the majority of the askvoat community did not want her to be the owner of the sub. The spirit of Voat is that of democracy, i.e. majority rules. So, regardless of the majority's position or reasons, shouldn't the fact that they nearly unanimously voted no be enough? If the community doesn't want she as a mod, why should she be a mod?

[–] [deleted] 3 points 22 points (+25|-3) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] dragonpenis 1 points 29 points (+30|-1) ago 

You're putting too much faith on people or you're just pulling Steve Huffman and waiting for Voat to grow, playing the right tunes as each community outrage occurs. I've already seen mods and admins interact on a rather too friendly terms, and that can only lead to more cases of cronyism/decisions that favors inner circles. It would be wise to cease any communications with the mods outside professional activities.

OR you should consider going completely modless and make most processes automatic. You could easily create a self moderated community system where users get points for accurate downvoting/marking items for deletion. Subverses could work more like hashtags than the current closed in system. Anything that can work without mods and subverse ownership system will be for better.

For this to be just a clone of Reddit, you will repeat its mistakes. It's important for you to understand that while this is your website, the people who populate this community are largely by nature ideologically charged. We're here because we left a SJW/pro-censorship site. Ergo we are anti-SJW and anti-censorship. If you are not ideologically in line with your community, let us know early so we can find another site. Don't play the long con on the very people who made Voat grow in the early days.

Listen to your community and don't play the PR game. Stopping SJW infiltration on this site will be a game of whack-a-mole and we're going to require your active participation.

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[–] Atko 0 points 39 points (+39|-0) ago 

Thank you, I have demonstrated many times over how I am listening to Voat users and this time will not be any different. We'll come out with a new announcement in a few days detailing our plan and our next course of action.

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[–] ThizzBoss 1 points 10 points (+11|-1) ago 

I'm a 6 month old account and I donated $20 to the site not long after I joined. I'm deleting this account in 24hrs if the askvoat situation is not fixed. There's already mod abuse on other subverses (news) but put tito ut ' s decision was a slap in the face to the community. If that's how you're going to run the site, I'm out of here. It's not free speech if some of the most hated reddit-tier power users get preferential treatment at the expense of the community

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[–] CptCmdrAwesome 1 points 9 points (+10|-1) ago 

What you're asking for would create the need for us to continue getting involved every time a moderator decides to do something Voat users don't approve of.

You're already way, way involved in this one.

It would be nice to see some kind of genuine attempt at addressing some of these points that he's made. I realise your time (and probably patience when it comes to this debacle) is limited. If it's of any consolation, you're not the only one.

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[–] Chuck_Testa 0 points 15 points (+15|-0) ago 

I was really happy with Voat when I came here over a month ago, loved the community, thought atko was doing a great job, but now it just seems dirty and wrong, kind of like it was feeling over at Reddit before I left. I personally don't have any problem with a SJW modding a subverse, what I have a real, real problem with is censoring material that does not fit the ideological perspective of the mod, and using underhanded tactics to acquire more subverses to control content.

I think its great to see members of this community standing up to what they feel are injustices, or violations of the rules. Does it go to far, maybe, but I think we have a hypersensitive audience, particularly the Reddit refugees, they/ me are on edge for any type of censoring or power grabs.

I think the admins of this site deserve a real pat on the back, thank you for taking this so far so quickly, I think they have done a great job, but with that said I have to say PuttItOut's post the other day, with this statement "the small vocal group intent on creating division" _and "this community is just as vicious, just as judgmental, and just as intolerant." was inappropriate in my opinion, as an admin., or any leader of an organization, you may have very strong feelings towards your client, but you don't vocalize it, instead you keep it to yourself and look for solutions.

I hope things change quickly because I see this situation devolving into a position of no return. Listen to the users, be decisive , and stand on the principles for which Voat was created.

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[–] Rea11yN0tMe 1 points 4 points (+5|-1) ago 

I was really happy with Voat when I came here over a month ago, loved the community, thought atko was doing a great job, but now it just seems dirty and wrong, kind of like it was feeling over at Reddit before I left.

Exactly how I feel as well. Only difference is that I came here two months ago.

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[–] Chuck_Testa 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago  (edited ago)

I hear you, actually I was a little off as to when I came over, it's 2 months today- still a newbie obviously.

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[–] chronos 0 points 13 points (+13|-0) ago 

Hi. I've been around a bit longer than the average Voat user so want to throw in my 2 cents, specifically about @Moe and @DanielFlamino.

I have watched this controversy unfold and will not get into specifics of he said / "she" said (pardon the pun). I am no fan of @Moe as we had it out many months ago. In that time I have watched them very carefully as I suspected they were some sort of high level troll. The truth is, they appear to be just another wacky Voater. I've seen them be incredibly consistent when it comes to standing up for freedom of speech on Voat. In this case, I see them adhering to the subverse transfer rules (which I myself have benefited from, but not due to any cronyism).

As for @Danielflamino, he has been a grade A, first class, kick ass dude from day 1. I have never seen any cabal or SJW behavior from him. I actually take a bit of offense and issue with anyone attacking him as he has tirelessly worked to improve this site MONTHS before many of you (including you OP) showed up here. He single handedly seemed to monitor /v/voatdev and answer questions and provide input on bug reports well before the two big migrations starting in June. I cannot speak highly enough of @DanielFlamino.

I've been pretty quiet on here due to some personal issues, but take a look at my history and you will see I am no cabal member or SJW lover. In fact when I first got here I created /v/antigot to call out SJWs, trolls and shills.

So take my words with whatever weight you feel they are worth, but I think you missed the boat here @FitMachoNaziAtheist.

I think you have valid concerns, but I don't think the answer lies in some IRC rooted conspiracy. I should mention I was on IRC when they first brought it up, but never got to involved there.

I don't think everything has been handled perfectly, nor would I expect it to be. We've gone through many phases of growth and sometimes the admins and mods miss the boat. Just look at how most things are handled here -- with grace, truth and transparency.

Anyways, this is my first and probably last comment on this topic. I hope someone benefits from it. If not, sorry for wasting your time.

Peace -- Chronos

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[–] SuperConductiveRabbi 3 points 12 points (+15|-3) ago  (edited ago)

Just because the community wants She gone doesn't mean that the subverse transfer request was invalid. That was @PuttItOut 's point in the post the other day. That regardless of personal feelings, the rules shouldn't be permitted to be changed simply based on the opinions of the person in question.

Now, as to whether an 80% majority should have the power to de-mod a moderator, that's something else entirely, and the answer is quite possibly yes. Mods are not owners of subverses, they're mere janitors and stewards.

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[–] mr_skeltal 0 points 18 points (+18|-0) ago 

They say mob rule, I say power to the people.

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[–] SuperConductiveRabbi 4 points 4 points (+8|-4) ago 

There should surely be some balance. There's the very real possibility of a tyranny of the majority or mod positions turning into popularity contests. Making these rules best for everyone is in Voat's best interest. Do you really think SJWs couldn't find a way to organize witch hunts up until their cronies were put in charge?

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[–] FitMachoNaziAtheist [S] 3 points 7 points (+10|-3) ago  (edited ago)

At the same time, just because the subverse request was valid doesn't mean it has to be granted. There's no rule outlining that. The admins complied because they wanted to. They could have taken a different course of action without breaking any rules.

Likewise there's no rule invalidating some of the AskVoat requests that were made later. Nomerasques had that argument with DanielFlamino and won. Flamino had to come up with invisible rules.

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[–] SuperConductiveRabbi 7 points -3 points (+4|-7) ago  (edited ago)

This isn't how rules work. The rules outline what you need to do in order to have a valid subverse request. If you meet those requirements, the subverse request is valid and thus should be granted. Anything else would be showing preferential treatment.

Do you propose that the admins look into the post history of the person making the transfer request, weigh the opinions they hold, and then use that to determine whether or not the valid transfer request should be granted? That's exactly the sort of preferential treatment that we're trying to escape from on Reddit.

Users should be given equal ground, the rules should be enforced fairly and consistently, and a person's opinions shouldn't be grounds to alter the rules to punish or reward them in particular.

If you're making the claim that the users need a way to kick out mods that prove to be harmful to the community, however, that's something else entirely, and a discussion worth having. It's also a tricky idea, because you can quite easily imagine how SJWs would organize witch hunts and false flag attacks until they're the ones that get into power, at which point the manufactured outrage would disappear. Issues like this are why it's so important that the rules be applied fairly and without resorting to looking at the person's post history to determine whether or not they should receive treatment that goes beyond the rules.

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[–] incoming- 0 points 11 points (+11|-0) ago 

I don't see how going back to reddit helps much.

I went to /r/politics and couldn't stand the cultist following of Bernie Sanders. I like him more than Hillary but he AIN'T PERFECT

So I returned back here.

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[–] LOLThatsJustRetarded 1 points 13 points (+14|-1) ago 

If I'm going to get reddit either way, I may as well get the real reddit.

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[–] FitMachoNaziAtheist [S] 4 points 5 points (+9|-4) ago  (edited ago)

Went back to reddit, voat is no different.

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[–] incoming- 4 points 4 points (+8|-4) ago 

Tell me my eyes are not deceiving me, but you have commented "Went back to reddit, voat is no different." on almost literally every submission you comment in.

I don't think that's very worthwhile content to begin with, so whatever contribution and building you were referring to seems to have stopped a while ago.

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