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[–] Kar98 3 points 12 points (+15|-3) ago 

Fucking low-life piece of shit anti EU, anti German propaganda. Did Greece just get bombed into rubble? Did Greece just lose millions of its population? Did Greece just lose a third of its territory? Did the rest of Greece just get divided into 4 occupational zones? Is what industry and intellectual property that survived aforementioned bombing into rubble get shipped off to the occupying powers? Do Greece women have to pick out bricks from the ruins to rebuild their country just now? Was the bombing into rubble the result of Greece trying to get out from under the prospect of 100 years of crippling payments to foreign powers?

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[–] mburke1124 1 point 5 points (+6|-1) ago 

Fucking low-life piece of shit anti EU, anti German propaganda.

That's a good way to start an open dialog about the article!

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[–] tortulho 2 points 0 points (+2|-2) ago 

That discussion tactic was taken word for word from Syriza's bailout negotiation plan, except /u/Kar98 didn't used any wild conspiracy theories sprinkled with anti-capitalist delusional ramblings.

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[–] aboutillegals 1 point 2 points (+3|-1) ago 

And don´t forget Germany was under occupation until 1990, and the allies had substantial influence onto German economic (and all other) policies, and had a clear oversight over everything going on in the country.

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[–] EroticPudding 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

I think that you somehow missed the point of the article.

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[–] Kar98 3 points -1 points (+2|-3) ago 

"If it hadn't been for the benevolence of the Allied Powers, Germany would only exist as a small agrarian country." Was that not the point the article was making?

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[–] wtrnl 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

Ah, but what would happen if Germany behaved towards Greece the way America behaved towards Germany? What would that even look like? A lot of financial aid at the cost of near-total loss of Greek sovereignty?

[–] [deleted] ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] Kar98 1 point 2 points (+3|-1) ago 

The Marshall Plan was, in parts, loans that have long been paid back, and all sides profited from it greatly. Excepting East Germany. Debt "forgiveness" was roughly in the amount of "debt" Germany was laden with after the "treaty" of Versailles. Germany, both as a whole, and as West Germany and East Germany, lost its sovereignty for decades, paid billions in reparations, and some argue even re-unification in 1990 didn't bring back full sovereignty. Seeing how certain parties demand Germany keep paying and paying and don't even ask what for, I can see where they would come with that point of view.

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[–] PhD_in_basket_waving 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

Interesting read!

[–] [deleted] 0 points 1 point (+1|-0) ago 

[Deleted]

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[–] PhD_in_basket_waving 0 points 1 point (+1|-0) ago 

I reposted this same article to "that other place" hoping, as it is still more frequented" to get some interesting discussion going. Looking at history is an interesting exercise on its own. But I didn't get any feed back wort mentioning. One guy (or gal) flat out admitted not even having given a glance to the piece.

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[–] KILL_ALL_GERMANS 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

It's a shame the Allies didn't go through with the Morgenthau plan.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgenthau_Plan

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[–] 3DimenZ 0 points 6 points (+6|-0) ago 

dat username tho

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[–] tortulho 1 point 5 points (+6|-1) ago 

It's a shame the Allies didn't go through with the Morgenthau plan.

Yeah, it worked very well after WW1, and europe would be such an awesome place after being ran over by the Soviet Union.

Oh, but no. Syriza's government screwed over Greece due to their gross incompetence manifested in their patronizing and offensive way they tried to pressure fellow eurozone members to pay off their election promises.

That must surely mean that committing a gross mistake in the past must be a good idea.

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[–] nonethewiser 0 points 1 point (+1|-0) ago 

The EU has been, from the outset, about exporting inflation and economic imperialism. Pretending to be amazed today that the inflation has been exported (as sovereign debt) and that the imperialism is in the wings (as privatizing nationalized assets) is disingenuous.

Did the Greeks benefit from their wanton spending? Yes, but to expect them to behave conservatively in the face of a corrupt government and financial system is foolish. A Greek bailout amounts to a massive divestiture of Greek wealth to punt Greece's failure down the road a decade or so. Greece will still fail, and the Greek people will be poorer for what amounts to a payday loan.

A Greek exit is inevitable. Everything from now until then is just kicking Greece and handing cash over to the banks.

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[–] aboutillegals ago 

inflation has been exported (as sovereign debt)

Could you explain it a little bit more how this idea works?

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[–] tortulho 2 points -1 points (+1|-2) ago 

Pretending to be amazed today that the inflation has been exported (as sovereign debt)

What a completely delusional comment.

Sovereign debt is piled on exclusively due to political will. A government needs to expressly order debt emissions to comply with their political will. Inflation has absolutely nothing to do with this. No government is forced to abuse the money printers of their central bank to print away the state's internal debt.

The euro only brought a need to actually manage a state responsibly. Spend what they have, use keynesian policies as an economic damper and not as a political propaganda tool, and never pile absurd amounts of debt.

And never, and I do mean never, falsify public records and defraud the world with accounting fraud.

This was Greece's problems, and now Syriza's governments managed to turn a problem into a catastrophe.

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[–] ixlen 1 point -1 points (+0|-1) ago 

What sort of life would we have if people could lie to obtain loans, ignore corruption, refuse to pay taxes, refuse to repay loans, falsify national economic data and then play the victim care when reality hits?

This idiot is comparing apples to oranges.