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[–] Rigel 0 points 13 points (+13|-0) ago 

"We defeated the wrong enemy"

-- General George S. Patton

look it up

[–] xeemee [S] 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

my German father fought for the U.S. while his brother fought for Germany - my father came to the same conclusion apparently

[–] rob_white 1 points 6 points (+7|-1) ago  (edited ago)

My degree is in history and have had a life long fascination with it, one of my keen areas of interest was WWII and from the German point of view, it's very frustrating to know much about a topic and not be able to bring it up as people do not understand the nuance.

It's downright childish and also additionally dangerous to just write off the Nazis as "evil", there is so much to learn and so much of it repeats today yet little is learned as there is no balance applied, it's either written off as a simply evil leader and government by most and then you have the storm-front assholes at the other extreme.

It's all still so politically charged even today that a sensible debate looking at both sides is really difficult outside of academia and even then their exits the winner's bias to some level.

It's quite interesting to watch Trump, while no where as smart or even close to a good orator as Hitler, basic things like scapegoating a minority work just as well today as they did then.

[–] xeemee [S] 1 points 2 points (+3|-1) ago 

it's very frustrating to know much about a topic and not be able to bring it up as people do not understand the nuance

tell me about it! we have been so brainwashed it's disgusting

as i'm sure you know, anyone who tries to challenge the mainstream version of history regarding Germany's role in the war, Hitler and the "holocaust" is auto-labeled as a racist supremacist neo-Nazi baby-killing scumbag

i bought into the official version all my life until about 12-15 years ago when i watched a documentary by a Jewish revisionist about Auschwitz which prompted me to wonder whether what i "knew" about the holocaust, Hitler, et al, was as accurate as i had assumed it was

i remember wondering whether this was really a subject i wanted to investigate because i was pretty certain i'd be rubbing elbows with neo-Nazis and such and i wanted nothing to do with any supremacist types - of course it turned out i was very wrong and, in fact, some of the very best work regarding historical revisionism regarding Germany's role in the war was authored by Jews or former Jews

a few quotes...

“I was in the big concentration camps in Germany. I must truthfully state that in no camp have I ever seen anything that might have resembled gas chambers.” — Dr. Benedikt Kautsky, Jewish prisoner of Auschwitz from 1938-1945, Did Six Million Really Die? p. 382

“Let me explain that even though I had been in Auschwitz I did not know about the gas chambers. Can you imagine that?” — Marika Frank Abrams, ‘Voices from the Holocaust’

“The [Nuremberg Trial was] the biggest legal farce in history… the legend about six million supposedly murdered Jews acquired a legal basis, even though the court did not have a single document signed by A. Hitler concerning the extermination of Jews…”– Rick Sanchez, former CNN correspondent, 2010

“We Jews are going to bring a war on Germany.” — David A. Brown, National Chairman, United Jewish Campaign, 1934

“The war now proposed is for the purpose of establishing Jewish hegemony throughout the world.” — Brigadier General George Van Horn Mosely, The New York Tribune, March 29, 1939

“The Second World War is being fought for the defense of the fundamentals of Judaism.” — Rabbi Felix Mendlesohn, Chicago Sentinel, October 8, 1942.

“We are not denying and are not afraid to confess that this war is our war and that it is waged for the liberation of Jewry… Stronger than all fronts together is our front, that of Jewry. We are not only giving this war our financial support on which the entire war production is based, we are not only providing our full propaganda power which is the moral energy that keeps this war going. The guarantee of victory is predominantly based on weakening the enemy forces, on destroying them in their own country, within the resistance. And we are the Trojan horses in the enemy’s fortress. Thousands of Jews living in Europe constitute the principal factor in the destruction of our enemy. There, our front is a fact and the most valuable aid for victory.” — Chaim Weizmann, President of the World Jewish Congress, Head of the Jewish Agency and later President of Israel, in a speech on December 3, 1942, in New York

“Played golf with Joe Kennedy (U.S. Ambassador to Britain). He says that Chamberlain stated that America and world Jewry forced England into World War II.” — James Forrestal, Secretary of the Navy, diary entry, December 27, 1945

“The world is aware how jealously the Jewish community guards the Holocaust, both as a memory and as a weapon.” — David Klinghoffer, ‘Our Role in Promoting Holocaust Denial’, December 30, 2005, The Jewish Daily Forward

“Care must be taken not to give a platform for deniers… or seek to disprove the deniers’ position through normal historical debate and rational argument” — Guidelines for Teaching about the Holocaust at the Stockholm International Forum, 2000

“[…] there was a Holocaust, which is, by the way, more easily said than demonstrated.” — Is There a New Anti-Semitism? A Conversation with Raul Hilberg, considered to be the world’s preeminent scholar of the Holocaust

“I describe incidents which may or may not have happened but which are true.” — Elie Wiesel — writer, professor, political activist, Nobel Laureate and alleged holocaust survivor — quoted from, Elie Wiesel: Conversations

“Given the nonsense that is turned out daily by the Holocaust industry, the wonder is that there are so few skeptics.” — Norman Finkelstein, Jewish American political scientist, activist, professor and author, quoted from his book ‘The Holocaust Industry’

[–] klusterVug 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

I don't consider some of the people on here credible or informative.

[–] Guide 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

Wait, so you're saying that the Jews started WW2 and there was no holocaust and it was all made up and Hitler was simply trying to defend the German people and all of Europe from the Jews?

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[–] rob_white 1 points 4 points (+5|-1) ago 

A lot of politicians are, people just don't look in to Hitler enough to draw the parallels, instead they have this simple "duh he was evil" label and that's the end of it.

Hitler was exceptionally successful at it and especially in speeches where he came across as personable and one of the people.

The key "trick", is to get people thinking emotionally as it bypasses their reason, Trump's example is immigrants; they take our jobs, they mooch from us and they rape our women. Combine that with appearing like an every man that will say what needs to be said and screw the PC stuff, people will lap it up.

Fortunately Trump also happens to have some large character flaws and it will all come undo for him at some point, but several countries, especially here in the US are susceptible to a charismatic leader using these techniques though, it worries me but Trump fortunately fails in the charisma department.

[–] LockeProposal 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

I haven't finished, but I hadn't seen this before and it's absolutely fascinating to see, thank you OP. My great-grandfather fought for the Wehrmacht (captured by the Allies in France), and my grandfather was in the Hitler Jugend. He spent much of the end of the war running from the Russians, seeing atrocities committed by both sides. It's fascinating to me, because when I study 1930s and 40s Germany, I'm looking into their world, and I'm seeing their home. Absolutely riveting stuff.

You may be interested in watching Unsere Mütter, unsere Väter. It's on Netflix under the title Generation War. It's a 3-part miniseries that does an absolutely jaw-dropping job of showing the war from the perspective of the Germans. Very sobering stuff.

[–] xeemee [S] 1 points 4 points (+5|-1) ago 

i agree - Germany's role in WW2 is a very interesting piece of history that still has a tremendous political and social impact today

my father was German but moved to the U.S. - he fought for the U.S. while his brother fought for Germany -- i think my father realized at some point that he joined the wrong team

i'm already d/ling Generation War with an extra part; Fact or Fiction

have you seen Adolf Hitler – The Greatest Story Never Told by Dennis Wise?

i have more links to videos here also

[–] LockeProposal 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

Saved the comment so that I can double back on all of this. That trailer for the Dennis Wise documentary was ridiculous lol. Hard to take it seriously with that announcer, but I won't knock it until I've seen it. Very excited to start watching these, thanks again :)

And I hope you enjoy Generation War as much as I did. It's the kind of thing that needed to be made, in my opinion.

[–] mansausage 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

Wow, I did not know that one before either, thanks. Very interesting, pretty good speech. Here in Germany it's almost like I think it's in America too, that they only show parts of speeches where Hitler is screaming aggressive things. You know, so that we all get he was a madman and don't turn into Nazis.

Quite shocking how well it fits what he observed about America there. Impressive how he called out America on messing with other countries for economic reasons and on the American gangster culture. Around 1940. Wow, that was great foresight, looking back at what the US did and do since then.

The thing is, given all the awful shit the Nazis pulled, I still don't agree with Patton that America "defeated the wrong enemy". From what I just read online, I assume when Patton said this he assumed it would be like after WW1 and the Allies would proceed to try and destroy Germany / the German economy forever. Which didn't happen - of course I am not a fool, I am well aware that it only did not happen because western Germany was needed to keep the communists at distance. Anyways, a win-win situation in hindsight.

[–] xeemee [S] 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago  (edited ago)

given all the awful shit the Nazis pulled, I still don't agree with Patton that America "defeated the wrong enemy"

i would willingly wager that if you study carefully who Hitler was, the NSDAP and Germany's role in WW2, that you may well change your opinions

i'm not a Hitler lover, racist or supremacist, and yes, certainly atrocities were committed by all sides, particularly by the allies, but when you look beyond what we have been taught in school and by the mainstream media, a very different picture emerges ... very different

Patton spent his whole life in the military and in battle - you have to wonder why he said that and why he wanted to steam roll communist Russia

one thing probably many people may not be aware of is that, according to Jewish history, the Jews were kicked out of approximately 67 countries prior to WW2 and persecuted in on other ways in as many more - does anyone ask why? were all these people of all these different countries and different philosophies racist pigs who just hated Jews for no good reason?

what Hitler did to the Jews was not at all unusual - it was par for the course - and look what happened to Germany when the Jewish businessmen, bankers and politicians were kicked out - never before in all of modern history has a nation been lifted to such heights and economic growth from the cesspool in which it wallowed in such an extremely short time - the 40 hr. work week, government subsidized vacations, policies to protect the environment, care of pregnant mothers, etc., etc., can all be attributed to A. Hitler

i have studied some crucial parts of this history and the story we've been given is a lie, i promise you this, and i urge you to dig much deeper into this history because it has immense political, monetary and social repercussions today, especially in Germany, the U.S. and the U.K. who are beaten over the head constantly with the alleged holocaust

have a listen to what Ernst Zundel had to say when he was interviewed by an Israeli journalist...

Ernst Zundel - Interviewed by an Israeli journalist (1996)

Ernst is one of the bravest men i know of - he's survived multiple attacks upon him and his property, having been burned and bombed of his home twice, as well as persecuted by the Canadian, U.S. and German governments including time in prison and through it all he has managed to keep a positive attitude and has always remained non-violent - by the way, Ernst is the reason that the Polish historians were forced to reduce the number of deaths at Auschwitz from ~4.1 million to ~700,000 - a reduction of ~3 million, yet the infamous "6 million" figure, which is a Jewish religious symbolic figure that can be traced back to the late 1800s, is very much allowed to stand as fact in the public mind

“The memory of the Holocaust is central to the New World Order.” — Ian J. Kagedan, director of government relations for B’nai B’rith Canada, Toronto Star, Nov. 26, 1991, p. A17

“Whilst large sections of the German nation are struggling for the preservation of their race, we Jews fill Germany with our vociferations. We supply the press with articles on the subject of its Christmas and Easter. We ridicule the highest ideals of the German nation and profane the matters which it holds sacred.” — Dr. Manfred Reifer, well known leader of the German Jews, Czernowitzer Allegemeine Zeitung magazine, Sep., 1933

“When they asked me, couldn’t you give money out of the United Jewish Appeal funds for the rescue of Jews in Europe, I said, ‘NO!’ and I say again ‘NO!’ … one should resist this wave which pushes the Zionist activities to secondary importance.” — Yitzchak Greenbaum, In Days of Holocaust and Destruction

“I was in the big concentration camps in Germany. I must truthfully state that in no camp have I ever seen anything that might have resembled gas chambers.” — Dr. Benedikt Kautsky, Jewish prisoner of Auschwitz from 1938-1945, Did Six Million Really Die? p. 382

[–] mansausage 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

Well, I have American friends in AZ and CA who are WW2 reenactors, so I am aware of certain positions. I am also aware that most of these people, just like you probably, are indeed not bad people.

My personal position is somewhere in the middle, though. I take it all with a grain of salt, while realizing that all sides have valid points.

So I have no doubt that Jews back then did stuff like preferring each other in business and got an advantage out of this, but on the other hand I am pretty sure many non-Jews didn't want to do business or have anything to do with Jews in general either. I also respect achievements that Jews got by outsmarting people - you can say what you want, but Jews seem to value education and don't mug others in the streets at gunpoint. So, yeah, even if they were mostly assholes, at least they are pretty much white collar assholes and not hood rats. (They developed Intel's "Core 2" and the latest Intel Skylake in Israel, by the way. As a German I appreciate superior engineering - and it is superior engineering.)

All in all I am not worried about Jews at all. I am worried about identity politics, SJWs, feminists, overpopulation in the third world... all the race and skin color and Jew and master race stuff is just outdated to me.

I love western civilization and I also like individualism and America (which I consider the greatest social experiment in human history) and I really think we should get our shit together in the west. We're not being taken down by China, the Jews, the blacks, "misogynists", or whatever - we're destroying ourselves from within. And if we don't get out shit together, we will go down and we will be replaced by something that will definitely be much much worse.

People tend to think that can't happen and that society only gets better and more civilized over time, but the history books tell a different story. Western civilization as we know it can absolutely crash and burn and our generation would be responsible for it.

[–] crunchberry 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

There is a family story that when my grandfather (who had moved form Germany to the U.S. ) heard the speech he began telling his friends that the translations in the papers were all wrong, not three days later he got a visit from some "government men" on his farm, they told him that it would be in his families best interest to "shut up about the kraut". Thanks for posting this video, I tend to agree with Patton's sentiment.

[–] xeemee [S] 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

the New York Times did, in fact, butcher his speeches

Hitler wanted peace while those that stood to gain from war with Germany (primarily Churchill) would have none of it

Israel would not exist were it not for the Balfour Declaration, Hitler and the Haavara Agreement

the policy regarding the Jews was one of extradition, not extermination, but, as they say, history is written by the winners

[–] TreeHugger 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

it was at first. but unless the allies made fake documents and had someone fake a speech for himmler on the extermination of the jews its pretty obvious they resorted to extermination when they had no other choice.


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