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[–] patriot_biz 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

As an American, I intend to stay the hell out of this. Let Europe solve their own problems. Buenos suerte, amigos!

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[–] ten_comments_is_dumb [S] 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

You're choice. Just looking for opinions, here.

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[–] patriot_biz 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Well I shall decline to provide an opinion. If you agree to the fee of one euro, I will give you instead security advice:

The future of Barcelona is with Spain. Autonomy is more than you need. Your security posture, bargaining power and civil rights will be better protected as part of a larger state. Unity is strength. My country (America) was once several countries but we are stronger as a whole.

!Vaya don dios, Senor!

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[–] Ceremonialpattycakes 0 points 4 points (+4|-0) ago 

Divide and conquer. Smaller countries are easier for the EU technobureaucrats to control.

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[–] ten_comments_is_dumb [S] 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Unite and rule. When smaller countries do not exist or have a collective identity, it's easier for global bureaucrats to administer the world with a convenient edict or pen-stroke.

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[–] HarlandKornfeld14 0 points 3 points (+3|-0) ago 

Catalonian independence will alter the balance of the EU, as there will be 5 Club Med countries instead of 4. Catalonia is also super liberal, the rest of Spain will become more right-wing. Other independence movements like in Flanders and Bavaria will be emboldened.

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[–] ten_comments_is_dumb [S] 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago  (edited ago)

My reaction to all of that is summarized in the last 3 letters of my original post: BFD.

Who cares? Globalism, meta-nationalism, federalism.... all a bunch of elites trying usurp the economy and cultural dynamism of smaller cultures. Do we really need that to build an maintain a better world? I just do not think so.

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[–] HarlandKornfeld14 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Yeah but it is a big deal because the Euro is a major currency next to the dollar. And the EU is a major economy next to the US. It's bound to send shockwaves.

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[–] ginganinja 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

Catalonia wants to be separate from Spain.

Catalonia is also responsible for 20% of Spain's GDP.

I have no stake in this, both sides have valid points, except for the part where Spain decided to use violence. That's just going to motivate Catalonians even further.

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[–] ten_comments_is_dumb [S] 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Spain want's Catalonia's money, and they're prepared to take it by force. Hooray for Spain.

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[–] KeifRomance777 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

There's definitely more europe can learn from them than steal.

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[–] ten_comments_is_dumb [S] 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Wow, well-said.

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[–] L3D 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago  (edited ago)

If majority of Catalans want to be independent, then that is entirely up to them. Catalans should do like the Scotts did, negotiate, debate and then a proper vote with international election observers and all.

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[–] ten_comments_is_dumb [S] 0 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago 

Well, they tried that, but Madrid declared their attempt illegal and they sent the military to beat people trying to vote in the referendum, and they arrested everyone who had anything to do with it. Even some people who had nothing to do with it. Now they're coming in to take over the local government and force everyone to be loyal. This is how these retards always play it out. And this is how they always fail.

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[–] ArsCortica 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

Imho it's economical suicide. Even if you argue that Catalonia technically has all the infrastructure necessary to function as an independent state due to its nature as a semi-autonomous region, a freshly formed Catalonia would have to apply as a new EU member state to gain access to the crucial European common market. The Catalan leaders so far handwaved this issue aside, arguing that the EU would be eager to get them back in as quickly as possible due to their economic output and over concerns regarding a second Brexit drama, but you better fucking believe that the Spanish would instantly veto any and all membership applications the Catalans would make.

Without access to the European common market, all those mighty companies that the Catalans are so proud of wold go tits up or at least lose a colossal amount of cash, severely weakening the already unstable economy of the young nation. And that's before you get to all the additional costs building your own little nation comes with.

Finally, the support for independence is by far not as monolithic as the pro-Independence figureheads make it out to be. Many Catalans were outraged by the move of the Spanish government and its police forces, but much as Bavarians maintain their dual identity as Bavarians and Germans, many Catalans see themselves as both Catalans and Spanish.

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[–] ten_comments_is_dumb [S] 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

90% in favor of independence is pretty overwhelming. I'm inclined to handwave the EU issue as well. Frankly, the EU needs Barcelona more than Barcelona needs the EU.

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[–] ArsCortica 0 points 0 points (+0|-0) ago 

90 in favor

And where did you get that number? Last time I checked, half the population didn't even take part in the vote.

Frankly, the EU needs Barcelona more than Barcelona needs the EU.

Doesn't matter whether the EU wants Barcelona or not. Unless the EU also is willing to give a big "fuck you" to Spain, one of its largest and most important member states, Catalonia will not become part of the EU. Or if it does, only after all other candidates in Eastern Europe had their turn.

This is the same kind of naive thinking as from the Brexiteers who thought the EU would just let Britain stay inside the shared market without so much as a peep despite of the fact that they shat all over the EU and then demanded their special treatment on top of that because the EU "needs" Britain.

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[–] Le_Squish 0 points 1 points (+1|-0) ago 

I believe in the people's right to sovereignty and self determination. Countries and empires should not be permanent things.

If they want to tell Spain to fuck off and are willing to die for it, I won't judge them. Good or Bad outcome, they choose their destiny.

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