[–] Joe_McCarthy [S] 0 points 2 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago
I think his point is that Byzantium is better dubbed Orient than Occident. Certainly Byzantine Syria being Western is a stretch. But your point is well taken nonetheless. A state that had continuity with Rome and was indeed known as the Roman Empire falls into the 'close enough' category - particularly given how Islam has impacted Western history proper.
[–] WORF_MOTORBOATS_TROI 0 points 2 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago
If you're interested, I elaborated a bit in reply to oswy's comment below.
[–] Oswy 0 points 2 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago
Exactly. Romano-Germanic and Graeco-Slavonic are probably better terms than West and East, or simply Latin versus Greek Christendom. You have to realise, Worf, that there wasn't really a pan-European feeling. The Crusaders' behaviour demonstrated this very clearly. We are only the heirs of Greece in various intellectual ways, it's not a direct succession at all.
[–] WORF_MOTORBOATS_TROI 0 points 1 point 1 point (+1|-0) ago (edited ago)
You're getting your timelines confused. I'm talking about the 7th century, the Byzantine empire continued for another 800 years after that and that has no bearing on my point There wasn't east vs west, there was civilization (Roman) vs barbarian (everyone else). There was no such thing as Romano-Germanic until Charlemagne united western europe 150 years later and had himself crowned holy roman emperor. The schism between latin and greek christendom occured 400 years later. The germanic tribes that migrated into france, spain, england, and north africa as the western roman empire crumbled had not been part of the roman empire.
The muslims started fighting the byzantines and the persians in the early 7th century. At that time the Byzantines were all that was left of western civilization. They owned sicily and like a third of italy, which were areas that preserved roman culture. This legacy was also preserved to a degree in the institution of the church.
The grermanic-romano high culture that emerged after Charlemagne conquered western europe was not sitting around latent in all these barbarians that migrated into francia only to spring to blossom when Charlemagne brought some stability to the area. That cultural heritage was fostered in the church and in the parts of europe that remained safe in the Byzantine empire and then spread back to the franks by Charlemagne.
Tl;dr if the 7th century byzantines were not "western civilization" then you are basically arguing that there was no such thing as western civilization until charlemagne.