[–] NakedWarrior ago
Licenses started out as a good method to keep unskilled and untrained people from practicing. I still think there are a lot of professions that must maintain a licensing standard in order to keep people safe. However, I do agree that some of the licensing has gotten ridiculous at certain levels and there are times when experience and skill should be taken into account as well. We all know that some licensing has increased in popularity due to the money the state can make from issue and testing fees. But the only way you can probably change this is through litigation.
[–] HillbillyGoat 0 points 2 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago
In some places, you can't even braid hair or wash dogs without going through a training program and getting "certified" and licensed. As a non-roofer, I'm a better roofer than most licensed professionals in my area. Occupational licensing is just a means to restrict competition and protect the brotherhood. It needs reigning in, badly.
[–] 45321200 0 points 1 point 1 point (+1|-0) ago (edited ago)
U.S. Constitution Article 6, Paragraph 2
“This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.”
Marbury v. Madison, 5 U.S. 137
Congress does not have the power to pass laws that override the Constitution, such as by expanding the scope of the Supreme Court’s original jurisdiction.
Murdock v. Pennsylvania, 319 U.S. 105
“No state shall convert a liberty into a license, and charge a fee therefore.”
Shuttlesworth v. City of Birmingham, Alabama, 373 U.S. 262
“If the State converts a right (liberty) into a privilege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right (liberty) with impunity.”
Norton v. Shelby County, 118 U.S. 425 (1886)
An unconstitutional act is not a law; it confers no rights; it imposes no duties; it affords no protection; it creates no office; it is in legal contemplation as inoperative as though it had never been passed.
[–] Angryelectrician ago
You can fuck off is what you can do. An electrical license is important because it is the last bastion between the illegals flooding in and pushing wages to the floor while performing substandard unprofessional and dangerous work. Having to renew your license is a pain, but it is the only thing protecting the electrical and plumbing trades from the fate of sheet rockers and drywallers. We don't need any more Mexicans on the job site. Shitting up the porta johns, sneering at hard working Americans that still earn a decent wage, playing their shitty music as loud as possible.
They want our jobs too. But as long as our licenses are tied to our SSN then they can get fucked and keep mixing their mud.
[–] [deleted] 0 points 1 point 1 point (+1|-0) ago
[–] Angryelectrician 0 points 1 point 1 point (+1|-0) ago (edited ago)
My state no longer recognizes Master electrician as a title. There is only Apprentice, Journeyman, Contractor. That is really how it should be. The mythical "Master" of electrical work doesn't exist because the field itself is far too dynamic to master anything. The NEC is re-written almost annually. And the trade itself covers such a vast scope of actual work that it would somebody a lifetime to master any one particular aspect, let alone the entire trade itself. Not to mention all of the changes in technology that will continually pop up and hamstring any type of pursuit.
edit* To your second point. I've met electrical engineers that couldn't put a receptacle in a wall without step by step instructions. I'm not one of these old bastards criticizing college kids either. They are just vastly different areas of knowledge. One exists in a utopia of how it should work. The other exists in a place where you have to be smart and experienced enough to make it work. These are relying on two different aspects of intelligence and therefore are very hard to cross examine.
[–] blumen4alles 1 point 0 points 1 point (+1|-1) ago
I worked in construction for many years and often had to coordinate with other trades, plumbers, pipe fitters, welders, insulators, electricians, etc. Just about every single time I had an issue with someone being an asshole it was with an electrician. You sound just like them. Me: "Hey man I see one of your ladders nearby and I need to get to this thing up there real quick - my ladder is three floors down & the elevator isn't working, can I borrow yours real quick?" Electrician: "Fuck off faggot!"
Once I had to troubleshoot a control panel freshly installed. The electrician was sure that the factory fucked up so I had to go out and take a look. Panel would shut down when certain circuits were energized at the same time. Turns out the licensed electrician did the field wiring incorrectly creating a dead short on a 480V 3PH system and the panel was doing its job protecting itself and the load. I had to show the electrician where they fucked up, then how to fix it as I was not allowed to make the necessary changes. Licensing means shit. Every time I am forced to have someone else do something because of licensing, I think "they do this every day, and I could do this task better than them - a task that I never have done or rarely do." I agree we don't need illegals taking citizens jobs, but damn I hate working with electricians who think their trade is special and treat other workers like they are beneath them.
[–] Angryelectrician 0 points 2 points 2 points (+2|-0) ago
I've been on a job where there was a shortage of ladders and people were competing for their job with only their productivity as a resume. Your situation may or may not have been in that type of environment, but I have been in those environments and seen how desperate and mean people can be. Yes there are a lot of electricians that are assholes. You just have to bypass them. There's nothing you can do about them. The only thing they want is to get a rise out of you. That's it. Don't feed the troll. There are good people working in the trade.
That guy was a fucking moron. The trade has just as many morons as any other work environment.
but damn I hate working with electricians who think their trade is special
I'll give you that one. It's like handing a medal to a high school drop out most of these guys. But think about it this way: those electricians you've encountered are obviously dumb assholes, and not only do we have to work around them all the time, but in many instances our lives are at stake with only those morons on the other end of the wire. Truth be told we could die every single day we show up. Just one dumb mistake.
[–] SpongeRobert 0 points 1 point 1 point (+1|-0) ago
Vote the bastards out, not that our votes are counted.
Hire unlicensed people. Make a point of avoiding people who are licensed.
[–] Cleanhobo 0 points 1 point 1 point (+1|-0) ago
Just do the job anyway and get paid under the table... Thats how you do it.
[–] Pawn 0 points 1 point 1 point (+1|-0) ago
thats how illegals do it and they get to avoid the jewish taxman in their wallets, why cant we americans get the perk of no taxes too.
[–] Hand_of_Node 0 points 1 point 1 point (+1|-0) ago
Because few bother to familiarize themselves with the rules of the game they're playing.
[–] blumen4alles 1 point -1 points 0 points (+0|-1) ago
Yuppers!